Battle of The Line Star Trek: Enterprise force augment.

[Agent23]

Variant 1)The entire United Earth (ST: ENT) Starfleet as of the start of the Romulan war is transported by Q into the orbit of the Babylon 5 universe Earth just prior to the Battle of the Line.

Variant 2) The same, however the UE starfleet will be replaced with that of the Terran Empire, just prior to the start of the rebellion mentioned in "A Mirror Darkly".

In both cases the captains and other higher ups will be briefed on the situation beforehand and instructed to aid the alternate universe Earth against the Boneheads.

So, can they swing it?

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Variant 1: to my knowledge, Star Fleet was still tiny at this point...around 25 combat vessels. So...no, Star Fleet won't have a truly meaningful presence. They'll increase the amount of damage taken by the Minbari for certain, and may even cause the Minbari to hold off a bit...OR they could just precisely jump into the Star Fleet formations and destroy them with opening Jump Points. The Minbari may not have shields, but those are BIG ships with advanced weapons that are definitely capable of hitting and destroying any Star Fleet vessel of that era.

Variant 2: I'm betting the Terrran Empire has a LOT more ships that Star Fleet so they'll definitely affect the battle. Enough to turn it? I've never read "A Mirror Darkly" so I really can't say.

 

[Agent23]

Variant 1: to my knowledge, Star Fleet was still tiny at this point...around 25 combat vessels. So...no, Star Fleet won't have a truly meaningful presence. They'll increase the amount of damage taken by the Minbari for certain, and may even cause the Minbari to hold off a bit...OR they could just precisely jump into the Star Fleet formations and destroy them with opening Jump Points. The Minbari may not have shields, but those are BIG ships with advanced weapons that are definitely capable of hitting and destroying any Star Fleet vessel of that era.

Variant 2: I'm betting the Terrran Empire has a LOT more ships that Star Fleet so they'll definitely affect the battle. Enough to turn it? I've never read "A Mirror Darkly" so I really can't say.

Well, a major part of the Boneheads' advantage comes from the fact that they have their weird stealth tech, could that generation of Starfleet sensors breech it for example.

As to the ENT mirrorverse, well it had enough ships to take Vulkan and a bunch of the other early UFP member planets and hold them.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Well, a major part of the Boneheads' advantage comes from the fact that they have their weird stealth tech, could that generation of Starfleet sensors breech it for example.

I imagine that they'd have some degree of success, but how much is really gonna depend on what the author wants. Minbari may not have had shields, but their hull was pretty darn tough anyway. Probably equivalent of polarized hull plating or close to it. (Though, quite honestly, polarizing the hull is just silly tech talk to say, "Look! Now they won't die in one shot!")

It's certainly possible that the Earth Force ships might be able to take advantage of said targeting attack. I definitely see that also increasing the damage against the Minbari.

You also have to remember that most of Earth's military was already destroyed at this point. What that means is the ST ships are instantly target priorities. A single Sharlin likely can destroy an NX Class vessel in just a few hits. The neutron lasers they sport are only exceeded in power by the weapons of the First Ones.

As to the ENT mirrorverse, well it had enough ships to take Vulkan and a bunch of the other early UFP member planets and hold them.

It's the numbers here that may be enough to turn the tide, but I'm doubtful. The Minbari had HUNDREDS of Sharlins. These are THE most powerful warships in the galaxy aside from the previously mentioned First Ones. Might have different tech trees than the ST 'verse, but the Minbari are a millenium ahead of the ENT Mirrorverse in development time.

 

[Agent23]

I imagine that they'd have some degree of success, but how much is really gonna depend on what the author wants. Minbari may not have had shields, but their hull was pretty darn tough anyway. Probably equivalent of polarized hull plating or close to it. (Though, quite honestly, polarizing the hull is just silly tech talk to say, "Look! Now they won't die in one shot!")

It's certainly possible that the Earth Force ships might be able to take advantage of said targeting attack. I definitely see that also increasing the damage against the Minbari.

You also have to remember that most of Earth's military was already destroyed at this point. What that means is the ST ships are instantly target priorities. A single Sharlin likely can destroy an NX Class vessel in just a few hits. The neutron lasers they sport are only exceeded in power by the weapons of the First Ones.

A lot of Trek tech approaches what we saw of the first ones in power levels, IMHO.

Also, from the black star incident we know that even a proximity detonation of an EA nuke can take out the biggest, baddest Sharlin out there, so trek weapons should be even more potent.
Also, their FTL can be used tactically and their STL speeds are much better than what most B5 races can manage.
So if the Trek ships are able to pierce Minbari stealth and pass targeting data to the hundreds of EA ships and static defenses, well that alone would be a game changer.

It's the numbers here that may be enough to turn the tide, but I'm doubtful. The Minbari had HUNDREDS of Sharlins. These are THE most powerful warships in the galaxy aside from the previously mentioned First Ones. Might have different tech trees than the ST 'verse, but the Minbari are a millenium ahead of the ENT Mirrorverse in development time.

A millenium in universe for B5 is not all that much compared to what earth did in a few hundred years in Trek IMHO.
Besides, that was basically Vorlon guided development, so they were probably kept down.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Actually tagging even UESF era ships is going to be positively nightmarish for the Minbari...B5 ships are slow outside of hyperspace by Trek standards.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Actually tagging even UESF era ships is going to be positively nightmarish for the Minbari...B5 ships are slow outside of hyperspace by Trek standards.

I don't buy that. Not at all. They are NOT White Star maneuverable at all, not even close. And those were pretty much the ONLY starships that made people miss by maneuvering.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

I don't buy that. Not at all. They are NOT White Star maneuverable at all, not even close. And those were pretty much the ONLY starships that made people miss by maneuvering.

A whitestar also cannot accelerate to 70% the speed of light.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

A whitestar also cannot accelerate to 70% the speed of light.

Who says? The only governor on the White Star's speed, according to JMS, was Plot.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Who says? The only governor on the White Star's speed, according to JMS, was Plot.

That's not a legitimate form of evidence though? You can't quantify "Because I say so" its why vs debaters everywhere except Spergbattles have a "fuck word of God only consistent high end showings matter from an evidentiary perspective".

 

[The Whispering Monk]

It is, quite literally, word from the creator of the show on how fast the White Stars are. We know they have gravity drives and inertial comps. So, why can't the White Stars go as fast as Star Trek ships?

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

It is, quite literally, word from the creator of the show on how fast the White Stars are. We know they have gravity drives and inertial comps. So, why can't the White Stars go as fast as Star Trek ships?

Because no vessel on B5 ever has?

 

[The Whispering Monk]

No vessel has needed to because they move faster with Jump tech. That doesn't mean they can't nor does it mean they haven't.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Nope...not touching those links.

 

[Agent23]

Why are we discussing the White Star's acceleration, when it was partially Vorlon tech?

We have never seen anything in B5 with the speed advantage that impulse drive can provide.

The Trek tech tree is a lot more advanced.

Nope...not touching those links.

Great, more spam attacks.
We need a better captcha or something.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

To my knowledge, the tech was pretty much a mixture of Minbari and Vorlon. It's never really stated which bits are which except for the regenerative hull being Vorlon.

Sure, ST may go faster in a straight line, but that doesn't prove maneuverability at all. In fact MOST ST ships are decidedly NOT very maneuverable. Birds of Prey and the Defiant class are the rare exceptions.

 

[Agent23]

To my knowledge, the tech was pretty much a mixture of Minbari and Vorlon. It's never really stated which bits are which except for the regenerative hull being Vorlon.

Sure, ST may go faster in a straight line, but that doesn't prove maneuverability at all. In fact MOST ST ships are decidedly NOT very maneuverable. Birds of Prey and the Defiant class are the rare exceptions.

Warp drive with its massive tactical advantages is even more of a disincentive to improve Trek STL imho.
You can warp from one end of a system to the other end.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Warp drive with its massive tactical advantages is even more of a disincentive to improve Trek STL imho.
You can warp from one end of a system to the other end.

The Minbari can too.

Drawback-requires multiple ships b/c of Jump Engine cool downs.
Advantage-can destroy a fleet by forming the jump points in the midst of their formations

 

[Agent23]

The Minbari can too.

Drawback-requires multiple ships b/c of Jump Engine cool downs.
Advantage-can destroy a fleet by forming the jump points in the midst of their formations

I do not recall them using microjumps in star systems, like, ever.

Jumpspace drive is a lot less flexible than Warp.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

It happens.