History Learner
Well-known member
Stalin suppressed abortion for most of his rule and TFR in the USSR shot up:
East Germany also had higher fertility than West Germany, as did most of the Warsaw Pact vs NATO:
American Political Policy Discussion Thread
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Stalin suppressed abortion for most of his rule and TFR in the USSR shot up:
East Germany also had higher fertility than West Germany, as did most of the Warsaw Pact vs NATO:
Simonbob
Well-known member
Interesting.
Modern China's not the same as the USSR, but it may well have that kind of effect. On the other hand, it might not. Soviet women were expected to be workers and mothers. China didn't do that, for a while.
They're trying now, but this kind of thing doesn't turn on a dime. We'll just have to wait and see.
History Learner
Well-known member
As I quoted that one Twitter chain above, it's unlikely the CCP will achieve a total abortion ban in effect, but even a 50%-75% reduction (Still less than what Stalin achieved) would still take their TFR from 1.05 to about 1.5 to 1.7 or so. That would put it ahead of just about everyone else in the Great Powers.
Vietnam, another Communist country in a modern context, has also maintained its TFR at healthy levels too (1.9 TFR, as of last figures):
History Learner
Well-known member
It's been awhile since I posted in here, so I thought I would do some demographics coverage since that's always a major topic of consideration nowadays.
1. White Voters, through fertility selection, are becoming more Right Wing:
2. This is especially true when you control for religion:
3. Black TFR is collapsing rapidly:
4. The above is true especially in the South:
Further evidence for fertility being selected for along political lines:
Simonbob
Well-known member
I did a bit of looking into that today. China, USSR, their way of looking at women.
One of the interesting things I found was that the social roles in China were much more formalised pre-commie than in the USSR nations, and under Mao they went consideralbly harder against gender roles, as part of breaking the older traditions.
That had a bigger effect on women in China than in the USSR nations. Added in, the USSR broke, and the current China didn't, and continued such policies much further.
End result? I'm not sure they can ban abortions like that. Their "cultural makeup" is more Feminist than many other places around the world. The political consequences might be too much.
Eh. I'm not an expert, but it does seem like the Chinese dug themselves deeper.
History Learner
Well-known member
The Stalinist ban successfully reduced abortion by 90% in a context with less State surveillance capabilities.
As to whether or not Chinese don’t want to have kids, that doesn’t really matter when they’re having 9 million abortions a year and if this is curtailed via the security forces.
Simonbob
Well-known member
And that doesn't come from thin air.
There are similar opinions, here in the West. The common factor, as far as I can tell? Feminism.
And the culture in USSR is completely diffrent then that of China.
So...they will force people not to get them...and so people decide to stop having sex all together and make things worse?
Or they just have abortions in thier homes because as surveillance heavy as they are, the chinese still have no full control over the singke aspects of thier lives.
add in the horrible construction that is causing a lot of deaths, the pain of the 1 child policy, and the fact there are way more men then women due to said former 1 child policy.....
Not just feminism in China from what I can gather.
They have a youth that don't want to work or have families because they want to rebel due to the nature of the country.
Unless you are rural then you have no choice to work, where as the city kids will basically do what ever but try to live up to the high standards if they can help it.
He'll, the China show on YouTube goes onto a lot of these things from time to time
Simonbob
Well-known member
That's gone, now. Still, there'd be results.....
I said former 1 child policy.
With the aspect that they have nit had any major uptick in births to the number needed to stop thier aging population.
The entirety of the newest generation would have to be having 5 plus families to make up for the generation gap they have
History Learner
Well-known member
Indeed, China has more surveillance capacity than Stalin's USSR has and this enables the State more capability to shut down abortion than the NKVD had back in the day.
Except we didn't see abortion bans resulting in this anywhere else.
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It is too late. Even with a abortion ban it wouldn't matter with how destroyed thier demographics are
Yes it does
Yes because illegal abortions performed in houeholds woth coat hangers will have statistics in a country where breaking the law is worse then death...
Russia is actually pretty well placed to survive:
China, if they can get abortion under control, could fix their demographic issues directly. They’re also mass adopting robotics in a way the West isn’t as a mitigation strategy:
1.Kgbsta,soviets killed Russia long ago.And they are replaced by muslims - white people are slowly replaced by brown ones there.
Not mention,that those white people are destroyed by vodka to the point where putin army do not want them.
Which mean,that they are not normal drunks,but human wrecks.
2.They still kill their doughters,even if they could have 2 children.One child policy killed them and their army - becouse army made by single sons would not risk their lives - they must survive to take care of their parents.
And commies do not pay anytching normal old people,only old commies.
History Learner
Well-known member
There's no evidence of this:
Again, there's very little to support this:
A study has found that the number of sex-selective abortions in China has plummeted since 2010 due to the restrictions of the fertility policy gradually loosening, the slump of fertility desire, and the weakening of son preference (Wang Penggang et al., 2021).
1.No evidence of vodka destroing white postsoviets,too?There's no evidence of this:
Again, there's very little to support this:
A study has found that the number of sex-selective abortions in China has plummeted since 2010 due to the restrictions of the fertility policy gradually loosening, the slump of fertility desire, and the weakening of son preference (Wang Penggang et al., 2021).
2.weakening son preference in China? are you joking? if they do not have sons,they would die from hunger as old people,becouse nobody would care about them.Certainly not commies.
You belive in kgbstan/China sources - good for you,but their sources are ALWAYS faked.
History Learner
Well-known member
1.white postsoviets still do not have kids - and postsoviet army still refuse part of them becouse of vodka.Which mean,that they must be half-dead.
2.No evidence that China commie state do not pay real moneys old people,who are not party bosses ?