What If? All Humans were turned into “Brutally Efficient Self Replicating Mechanisms of War”?

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag


People can suddenly process large amounts of information, harvest resources and create machines from nanobot streams coming from their bodies and control said machines

And maybe even make their own designs

We’re also Androids that can somehow reproduce still

Optionally this is a “design” for “Commander” bodies for females
images


This change begins at the start of 2020
 

ATP

Well-known member
If all people had such power ?
Transformation of states.Only those really approved by vast majority would survive.Which not means democracy - oligarchies and monarchies could still exists.
What would vanish - Nort Korea style dictators.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
If all people had such power ?
Transformation of states.Only those really approved by vast majority would survive.Which not means democracy - oligarchies and monarchies could still exists.
What would vanish - Nort Korea style dictators.

And South Korean plastic surgeons
 

Midnighter13

Well-known member
Well, the first thing that would happen is mass chaos as states collapse. All states rely on some degree of having the only legitimate use of force. If every single person suddenly had the ability to build their own armies, the power of states would be broken within days. Sure, no one person would be able to overrun the planet, there would be too many people competing for local resources, but violence would break out damn near everywhere as people explored, experimented, got into fights, and those fights escalated to military grade hardware or beyond. A small number of people would leave Earth to establish themselves across the solar system, and would immediately be pursued by tens of thousands more trying to copy them, prevent those people from building up, or just escape the violence that is occurring on earth. When anyone with control over a decent sized swath of territory can become a nuclear power within an hour, the planet would become a nuclear wasteland in short order. Someone would launch the first nuke, and after that it would become a free-for-all.

After the initial die-off and jockeying for power, the solar system would settle down into a new "world order" where people with the greatest amount of raw resources (and the numbers to defend them) would hold power. Those people would craft new societies that would take into account the fact that every citizen/subject/cult member/neighbor could be a nuclear power within an hour if they go unmonitored. I expect that most people would be under constant observation, or would be banned from acquiring the resources nessesary for mass construction. There would still be periodic violence as interpersonal arguments could rapidly escalate, but the existing leaders would probably implement policies designed to mitigate escalation. Still though, the solar system would still probably be too unstable and dangerous for a lot of people long term, and so you would see a lot of commanders leaving for other solar systems, probably in groups of a few to a few hundred at most. These groups would gradually form new societies with new social norms that permitted survival in such a heavily armed society. Those that failed to do so would die in nuclear fire.

The good news is, even on a galactic scale there will never be a runaway force capable of overrunning the galaxy. Everyone would have similar levels of construction capabilities, and would be able to defend themselves even against enemies that threw the resources of entire solar systems against them. In the end, most solar systems would become vast fortresses dedicated to holding off inconsistent raids and attacks by people looking to acquire more resources (and ideally, loyal followers).
 
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CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Well, the first thing that would happen is mass chaos as states collapse. All states rely on some degree of having the only legitimate use of force. If every single person suddenly had the ability to build their own armies, the power of states would be broken within days. Sure, no one person would be able to overrun the planet, there would be too many people competing for local resources, but violence would break out damn near everywhere as people explored, experimented, got into fights, and those fights escalated to military grade hardware or beyond. A small number of people would leave Earth to establish themselves across the solar system, and would immediately be pursued by tens of thousands more trying to copy them, prevent those people from building up, or just escape the violence that is occurring on earth. When anyone with control over a decent sized swath of territory can become a nuclear power within an hour, the planet would become a nuclear wasteland in short order. Someone would launch the first nuke, and after that it would become a free-for-all.

After the initial die-off and jockeying for power, the solar system would settle down into a new "world order" where people with the greatest amount of raw resources (and the numbers to defend them) would hold power. Those people would craft new societies that would take into account the fact that every citizen/subject/cult member/neighbor could be a nuclear power within an hour if they go unmonitored. I expect that most people would be under constant observation, or would be banned from acquiring the resources nessesary for mass construction. There would still be periodic violence as interpersonal arguments could rapidly escalate, but the existing leaders would probably implement policies designed to mandate escalation. Still though, the solar system would still probably be too unstable and dangerous for a lot of people long term, and so you would see a lot of commanders leaving for other solar systems, probably in groups of a few to a few hundred at most. These groups would gradually form new societies with new social norms that permitted survival in such a heavily armed society. Those that failed to do so would die in nuclear fire.

The good news is, even on a galactic scale there will never be a runaway force capable of overrunning the galaxy. Everyone would have similar levels of construction capabilities, and would be able to defend themselves even against enemies that threw the resources of entire solar systems against them. In the end, most solar systems would become vast fortresses dedicated to holding off inconsistent raids and attacks by people looking to acquire more resources (and ideally, loyal followers).

I guess even that constant state of war may go down after awhile

Some people may even many millenia later tell new generations about that time this “United Nations of The Homeworld” tried “regulating” everyone with a virus

Others may even tell their memories of living in slums....eventually I think people will even engage in society if only because they like the company and the conflict
 

ATP

Well-known member
I guess even that constant state of war may go down after awhile

Some people may even many millenia later tell new generations about that time this “United Nations of The Homeworld” tried “regulating” everyone with a virus

Others may even tell their memories of living in slums....eventually I think people will even engage in society if only because they like the company and the conflict

Indeed.After some time,most people would still live in states,becouse people do not like think for themselves.
Others - probably in families,i do not see possibility of lone people with superpowers,becouse we still need others to communicate.
Unless we really find or made cute alien/monster girls,then at least entire Japan population would go for them.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Indeed.After some time,most people would still live in states,becouse people do not like think for themselves.
Others - probably in families,i do not see possibility of lone people with superpowers,becouse we still need others to communicate.
Unless we really find or made cute alien/monster girls,then at least entire Japan population would go for them.

I expect for a new entertainment culture to be made

The guys from Japan will be seen as weird for sending out large armies of sexbots to battle against other guys’ minimecha
 

Midnighter13

Well-known member
I really can't see people with this level of power forming societies much larger than medium sized tribes. One of the requirements for these sort of societies will be everyone must get along at all times. They wouldn't be able to afford to have loners, or bullied people, or oppressed people, because all it takes is one person snapping, and instead of a school shooter or suicide bombing, you get a salvo of nuclear missiles thrown at population centers.

There may be some efforts to regulate that, but every sentient will be in charge of hundreds, if not thousands of factories, robots, spacecraft, etc, at all times. Each and every citizen will have the industry and military of a decent sized major power. How do you police that? Even if the state sent a squad of 'police commanders' and their legally sanctioned armies against a 'criminal commander' who was illegally building a force larger than was legal, the fighting would still destroy continents.

So I think in the end you would see tribes of 150 or smaller, because everyone involved has to implicitly trust every other member of their tribe at all times. Then, tribes might form alliances, and eventually you might see the rise of confederations. But a centrally directed state would be impossible when just a few members of one tribe could kick off a nuclear war if they were unhappy with a court decision, or a tax policy, or just blamed the government for whatever personal problems they had.

Socially, people would keep their real bodies hidden (known only to members of their tribe) and interact with people outside their tribe through remote piloted proxies. There would be enough interaction between tribes that some people would marry out of/into other allied tribes to maintain genetic diversity. But most of the time, everyone outside the close knit tribe would be seen with various levels of distrust and suspicion. Even members of the same alliance or confederation would be unlikely to share the locations of their real bodies unless they were changing tribes. Basically, people would know 'hey, that tribe over there controls that continent, and if you go visit you can send a proxy-bot to hang out with their proxy-bots at a 'bar' they've set up. But you would never see their physical bodies, just the vast factory complexes and industrial areas they control.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
So I think in the end you would see tribes of 150 or smaller, because everyone involved has to implicitly trust every other member of their tribe at all times. Then, tribes might form alliances, and eventually you might see the rise of confederations. But a centrally directed state would be impossible when just a few members of one tribe could kick off a nuclear war if they were unhappy with a court decision, or a tax policy, or just blamed the government for whatever personal problems they had.

I’m guessing this means something like a “Prime Directive” wouldn’t be a thing for even a few seconds

And if determined enough, you could see wars happening between “Mechanical Gods” as seen by native alien aborigines

Only way to get a big enough long lasting state? An existential threat like say a massive swarm of alien monsters from outside the galaxy or beyond the veil
 

ATP

Well-known member
I’m guessing this means something like a “Prime Directive” wouldn’t be a thing for even a few seconds

And if determined enough, you could see wars happening between “Mechanical Gods” as seen by native alien aborigines

Only way to get a big enough long lasting state? An existential threat like say a massive swarm of alien monsters from outside the galaxy or beyond the veil
Or somebody charismatic enough to keep big state together.With right medical technology,it would last as long as he/she.
 

Midnighter13

Well-known member
Or somebody charismatic enough to keep big state together.With right medical technology,it would last as long as he/she.
It really wouldn't. Charisma isn't enough when one angsty teen could nuke the capital within an hour of snapping, and blames the government for whatever is wrong with his life. The more people in a group, the greater the chances of someone using violence to get their way. Societies under this scenario would consist of everyone constantly holding everyone they know at metaphorical gunpoint (willingly or not). If just one person pulls the trigger it turns into a massive mess. The only way this works is if everyone in the group trust each other not to fire the loaded guns they have aimed at each other. Humans can only really trust about 150 max at that level. Any more than that, and people within the same group are going to start suspecting members of their own tribe, cue factionalism that will inevitably result in violence that shatters the tribe.

There is no state monopoly of violence under this scenario. The difference between someone who trains for war 12 hours every day, and an inexperienced teen who's never fought before is that the teen might take an extra hour to get to nuclear weaponry. Especially since the one combat expert has to be ready to respond to dozens or hundreds of people (read as effectively industrialized states) who might try to turn genocidal at a moments notice.

If you have a ratio of 1:10, the 'government' might be able to use force to maintain power (by dint of having enough spy planes and nuclear bombers under their command overflying their own people's territories at all time). But once that ratio starts getting to 1:100, or 1:1000, it becomes impossible.

And again, the larger the 'inner circle' of trusted combat experts grows, the greater the risk of a coup or civil war within the government itself. Think about how many dictators have been overthrown by their own generals, now realize that a coup could occur if a general just decided it, without having to bring in anyone but other generals. No need to sound out the troops, or do anything else to alert any spy or security services. A group of rebellious generals go to play cards one night, decide to launch a coup, and do it the next morning with no warning.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Hmmm....what about religious leader,then ? i mean religion in broader sense,which include communism.
Once he turn people into belivers,they would not fight him,and he would not need police,everyone would seek heretics without any central power.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Hmmm....what about religious leader,then ? i mean religion in broader sense,which include communism.
Once he turn people into belivers,they would not fight him,and he would not need police,everyone would seek heretics without any central power.

So people without much better to do, deciding to give themselves "purpose" by joining a cult?

A little harder when people don't exactly need each other to survive

They'll be a way to pass the time
 

Midnighter13

Well-known member
Hmmm....what about religious leader,then ? i mean religion in broader sense,which include communism.
Once he turn people into belivers,they would not fight him,and he would not need police,everyone would seek heretics without any central power.
At the level of society we are talking about, the line between politics and religion is effectively nonexistent. The tribal leader would also be the tribal shaman/priest/cleric/etc. Maybe power would get divided between the secular and religious leaders in the more stable tribes, but religion/ideology is not going to stabilize a larger society any more than a charismatic leader could.

Over time? If the religion is drilled into everyone from birth? That might help for a while, but then you get disagreements about doctrine and textual interpretations that lead to religious wars. Honestly, of all the things humans love to fight over, religion has always been one of the easiest, because religion has always been subjective enough that clever (or zealous) people have been able to use either their religion or someone else's religion to justify the violence they want to commit.

Long term, religious societies fracture and fight just as much (if not more so) than secular ones. Worse, because religious disagreements are based on faith rather than facts, they never end. The Catholics and Protestants are still fighting in Europe to this day (the last major flair up was the Irish Troubles). The Sunni and Shia are still fighting over a disagreement on religious inheritance from a thousand years ago, and that's after the Shia line of Mohamed (the people they were supposedly fighting to place as Caliphs over all of Islam) disappeared centuries ago, along with the caliphate itself.

You give a hundred secular people the power of an ACU, and they might figure out a way to mediate disagreements in a way where each side accepts that there is no hard right or wrong side, and they should just avoid each other until they calm down (or until their kids can solve the interpersonal issues between their parents). Its nowhere near guaranteed (secular people can get their backs up over silly things too) but most secular people don't believe that their opinions are ordained by G-d as correct and immutable. Give the same power to religious people and they will be less likely to fight initially, but when conflicts do develop there won't be any middle ground possible because each side will believe they are fundamentally right, and the other side are fundamentally wrong. That's a recipe for almost guaranteed violence, probably nuclear at least.

Its one thing for people to disagree about tax policies, even if the policy hurts you. You know that your opponents are trying to do what they see as right, and you can always come back and change the policy later. With religion, that's not an option. Either you can do what the argument is about or you cannot, and neither party can accept that both sides are right, because by accepting something they believe to be false they are harming their own faith and worldview. The same issue applies to non-religious dogma. The Cultural Revolution was full of people fighting for "True Communism" which was whatever they defined it as. Its the 'No True Scotsman' fallacy, scaled up to the worldviews of entire populations.
 

ATP

Well-known member
So maybe scientist-style sect ? rich dudes are paing billions to them willingly now,so why not gather superpowered humans in this TL,too ?
 

PeliusAnar

Well-known member
All of you are forgetting a key fact. When a commander dies, it goes nuclear. The cities would be engulfed in a chain reaction. Only people living in the wilderness would have a chance.
 

IceWing_mk1

Well-known member
I think you mistitled the thread.

It should read "What if all humans were turned into a DIFFERENT brutally efficient self replicating mechanisms of war?"

Because, frankly, we pretty much already excel at being brutally efficient self replicating mechanisms of war...
 
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