Bell V-280 Valor Tiltrotor Helicopter To Replace the US Armies Blackhawks
- Thread starter Husky_Khan
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From a technical point of view, certainly. On the other hand, the Air Force was rather well-justified in doubting Northrop's ability to actually deliver projects even *remotely* on time and on budget, and as I understand things that was the biggest factor. That and while Northrop's engineering and design were just as good, Lockheed were the ones who realized they had to *sell* the design to non-technical decision makers, which is why they used a substantial amount of their very limited test schedule to do unnecessary but flashy demonstrations.
YF-22 had better low-speed agility, YF-23 had better high-speed handling. Those huge tailerons were really something; Northrop had to invent an entirely new type of actuator to run them, and they gave so much control authority that the YF-23's lack of thrust vectoring did not make any substantial difference; the -22's agility edge was primarily a matter of platform optimization.
mrttao
Well-known member
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Russia is not the only country with corruption.
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The military-industrial complex in a nutshell. Honestly I wonder sometimes if they don't fuck things up on purpose so as to draw out the development phase after they have the contract as an excuse to milk more money out of it. 
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I'm surprised surviving injured Marines didn't firebomb the manufacturer's HQ.The military-industrial complex in a nutshell. Honestly I wonder sometimes if they don't fuck things up on purpose so as to draw out the development phase after they have the contract as an excuse to milk more money out of it.
mrttao
Well-known member
what is your point? are you saying we should cut them slack, or saying that it is even worse than we thought?
No, I'm saying the Army chose the one that actually met deadlines
mrttao
Well-known member
meeting deadlines is very much not the impression i got from the video linked.
It's Angry Cops.
Which ever one win, he would have made the video.
The whole thing is the UH 60 is completely outdated and too slow.
He also doesn't look at how the Oesprey is favored by Marines over the Huey they jahe due to its fast flying capabilities.
The Valor still has a lot to go but AC is just having fun with the video.
You can look at various other Youtubers who have broken down the diffrence
mrttao
Well-known member
Angry cops seem to have legitimate criticisms here though.
one of the two new replacement choppers has only 1 video of it actually flying... which is actually a low quality greenscreen with crappy CGI.
the other one crashed on the first test flight, and has been grounded from 2017 to 2019 due to the developer not being able to figure out how to make its drive train work.
Yea the current choppers are old and it would be great to get an upgrade.
That doesn't mean throw money at any conman that comes your way
You do know Blackhawks are having increased crashes due to age right?
And you donknow the Valor has plenty of footage of it flying? More then the defiant.
The footage he showed was of it as an attacker since that version hasn't even been made yet.
mrttao
Well-known member
then build new ones from the same design
fair enough. although that does not look like anywhere near the 300+ mph quoted figure.
I will note that in the first several years of service (back in the 1980s) the UH-60 suffered at least 5 major crashes that killed more people than all Osprey crashes to date due to avionics issues, and that is with conventional helicopters being a well-proven design by that point.
The overall safety record of the Osprey is actually better than any other rotorcraft platform at a similar point in its development AND overall. With the Valor building upon that success I suspect that it will have a similarly excellent safety record.
I should also note that none of the recent Black Hawk losses were 'old' airframes, the one in the Philippines had come off the production line just 6 months prior, while the one in Mexico was less than two years old.
The overall safety record of the Osprey is actually better than any other rotorcraft platform at a similar point in its development AND overall. With the Valor building upon that success I suspect that it will have a similarly excellent safety record.
I should also note that none of the recent Black Hawk losses were 'old' airframes, the one in the Philippines had come off the production line just 6 months prior, while the one in Mexico was less than two years old.
Again, seems like you have a problem of claiming shit didn't happen because you didn't see any evidence, while you didn't put any effort into looking for said evidence, which naturally results in you not seeing it.
The Valor is faster, has lower drag, and better fuel economy and range. The Defiant has better maneuverability, with a tight turning radius at moderate speeds, but pays for it with vibration at high speed constantly trying to shake the aircraft apart, necessitating counter-vibration active force generators all over the aircraft producing a vibration 180 degrees out of phase with the one from the rotors.
I think the Defiant looks cooler, but the Valor is clearly the superior aircraft.
I think the Defiant looks cooler, but the Valor is clearly the superior aircraft.
One thing that needs mentioning here is that V-280 was a good fit to near future strategic needs. AKA the China business, in which there is less concern about landing in tight spaces, and a lot of concern about operational ranges and speeds due to the need for island hopping; a winged tilt rotor is destined by physics to have an advantage there over more conventional helicopters.