Britain Why Conservatives conserve nothing

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
There are virtually limitless modes of interpreting meaning and reality, but not every narrative is equally useful.

Or remotely consistent

If anything, the lack or consistency helps give a person trying to gain control over others an unprecedented power

It’s how I see SJWs or other Far Left types deal with their detractors, they deny they exist and deny that they’re banning and censoring things or are prudes of some sort

And even go “They’re a private business(Twitter & Google)they can choose their customers” whilst saying “Just make them the cake!!!”

This subjectivism helps run circles around a guy until he manages to realize that A is A, 2+2=4, a solid is a solid etc to ground them in reality whilst using logic to understand experiences or what they’ve seen
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
I said the clock only goes one way, which is the absolute truth.

Tech won't disappear, we aren't going to forget germ theory, or quantum/astro-physics, forget liberals ideas, or go back to being serfs to anyone.

The direction of civilzation can be directed to many paths, but time cannot be rewound.

Perhaps you are unaware of these things called 'The Bronze Age Collapse' and 'The Fall of the Roman Empire.' There's a reason that the period immediately after the fall of the Roman Empire is referred to as the 'Dark Ages' in Europe.

It is absolutely possible to have both civilization and technology levels regress. Given how sophisticated and interdependent modern economies are, it is entirely possible for war or collapse of social order to cause technology and the means for sustaining it to fail as well. Just look at what happened to Venezuela.

Will that happen again on a world-wide scale? I honestly do not know, but it has happened before, and the idea that it can't is thoroughly historically disproven.

Further, plenty of nations have regressed into serfdom. Again, look at Venezuela. Many nations have gone from serfdom/nearly so, to worse; look at the USSR, China, North Korea, etc, etc.

Frankly, you don't seem to be aware of what much of the world outside North America, Europe, and Commonwealth nations tends to be like.


Also, regarding Original Sin:

The interpretation of 'Original Sin' that is bandied about by Christianity's critics, is generally the hard-line Calvinist interpretation that paints Christianity in the worst light. That interpretation is the 'Adam sinned, so all of humanity is now damned to hell.' This is not a correct interpretation, and it isn't even one that is held by the majority of Christians. A lot of 'christians' don't even really know what the concept actually is.

The actual meaning of Original Sin, is (using simple language rather than what you'd hear at a bible college) that once sin entered into the world through Adam and Eve's actions, all were then able to sin easily. To put it one way, before eating the forbidden fruit, there was only one moral law. 'Don't eat the forbidden fruit.' After that, the full breadth of the moral law as we know it now became necessary.

'Don't steal. Don't murder. Don't rape. Don't be a jerk.'

Bluntly put, you are trying to tar all of Christianity, with an interpretation of a doctrine that is flatly heretical even within Christianity. Sure, a disturbingly large number of christians happen to believe that heresy, but like most people inhabiting the anti-Christian reactionary cultural space, you seem to have fallen into the habit of taking Christianity's critics at their word immediately, and not checking to see what Christianity's champions have to say in response. I say 'seem' because your attitude appears to fit the pattern, but I don't know for sure.
 

Duke Nukem

Hail to the king baby
I think part of the problem is that most people only know a VERY abridged version of politics, science, economics, history, philosophy, psychology and even regarding their so-called “enemies” in-regards to politics

One justification for communism I’ve heard is that “Humans are inherently communist, because humans are social animals”

Nevermind that even at our most primitive states we were prone to violence and hierarchies and greediness and lust

Our bodies are still those of our cavemen ancestors

The 7+1 Deadly Sins are the result of our instincts provides by evolution REALLY not being good to deal with society but were for disgusting animals

1. Pride was for leadership or asserting dominance
2. Greed was for constantly hoarding items that would possibly be useful and possibly using it for bargaining
3. Lust was for encouraging reproduction because a species was always in danger and needed new kids to do stuff and things like faithfulness and monogamy was something that felt like going against that subconscious goal
4. Envy was for making men and women feel threatened by the presence of others who may steal mates and also had what they wanted/needed to survive
5. Gluttony was because our ancestors would never truly know when their next meal was and needed that energency fat and may lose their current meal all of a sudden
6. Wrath was for combat and survival, you’d hit harder if you were angry and ignore your wounds
7. Sloth was because you’d need as much rest as possible and humans were endurance predators and our bodies weren’t meant to push themselves so hard and constantly
8. Apathy was because trying to care about everyone or everything could leave a guy a nervous wreck and there wasn’t always room for mercy in the middle of battle nor could you spend too much time grieving for losses

Compassion and Love are also instincts we got, but even they have to deal with the rest

Try to make people Communist and you’ll end up with guys ontop who may let all 7+1 sins run rampant in their bodies or get in conflict with the latter as being well-intentioned isn’t so useful if you’re NOT smart and able to deal with so much power and responsibility

Communism only works for insect colonies pretty much.
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
Mapping anything as complex and idiosyncratic as political ideology onto only two options is so misleading as to be essentially worthless. Trying to generalize political ideology from one nation to other nations tends to be even stupider.

The Tory's in the UK are conservative in that they have had the same driving principals for the past hundred years; change as little as possible from yesterday as is necessary to retain power and retain control of the government in the hands of the correct people.

---
But no, the GOP has never really been a "conservative" party except when compared to the Democrats. Just like the Tories have never really been a "conservative" party except when compared to Labour. Conservative is a false label
These points here very much match what the video states. There is no such thing as a true conservative party. We are stuck in a paradigm of Liberals vs Leftists. And the argument goes that liberals merely slow things down but don't actually stop the march of Leftism.

As explained in the video, the Tories have done nothing about Immigration and its apparently higher now then before. And the video attributes this to Tories being paid and supported by corporations who support leftism cause profits. Your own post has it that the Tories mean to just change as little as possible and since unchecked Immigration was ongoing, they just left it as is betraying the people that voted for them.

The fundamental issue facing those that oppose leftism is that the corporates support leftism cause leftism pushes for endless immigration and other policies but they like the Immigration part a lot cause it means more and more people to buy smartphones or whatever.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Perhaps you are unaware of these things called 'The Bronze Age Collapse' and 'The Fall of the Roman Empire.' There's a reason that the period immediately after the fall of the Roman Empire is referred to as the 'Dark Ages' in Europe.

It is absolutely possible to have both civilization and technology levels regress. Given how sophisticated and interdependent modern economies are, it is entirely possible for war or collapse of social order to cause technology and the means for sustaining it to fail as well. Just look at what happened to Venezuela.

Will that happen again on a world-wide scale? I honestly do not know, but it has happened before, and the idea that it can't is thoroughly historically disproven.

Further, plenty of nations have regressed into serfdom. Again, look at Venezuela. Many nations have gone from serfdom/nearly so, to worse; look at the USSR, China, North Korea, etc, etc.

Frankly, you don't seem to be aware of what much of the world outside North America, Europe, and Commonwealth nations tends to be like.


Also, regarding Original Sin:

The interpretation of 'Original Sin' that is bandied about by Christianity's critics, is generally the hard-line Calvinist interpretation that paints Christianity in the worst light. That interpretation is the 'Adam sinned, so all of humanity is now damned to hell.' This is not a correct interpretation, and it isn't even one that is held by the majority of Christians. A lot of 'christians' don't even really know what the concept actually is.

The actual meaning of Original Sin, is (using simple language rather than what you'd hear at a bible college) that once sin entered into the world through Adam and Eve's actions, all were then able to sin easily. To put it one way, before eating the forbidden fruit, there was only one moral law. 'Don't eat the forbidden fruit.' After that, the full breadth of the moral law as we know it now became necessary.

'Don't steal. Don't murder. Don't rape. Don't be a jerk.'

Bluntly put, you are trying to tar all of Christianity, with an interpretation of a doctrine that is flatly heretical even within Christianity. Sure, a disturbingly large number of christians happen to believe that heresy, but like most people inhabiting the anti-Christian reactionary cultural space, you seem to have fallen into the habit of taking Christianity's critics at their word immediately, and not checking to see what Christianity's champions have to say in response. I say 'seem' because your attitude appears to fit the pattern, but I don't know for sure.

Maybe it was better for everyone to exist in sheer “innocence” and be stuck at a Hunter-Gatherer or mostly Gatherer life in that Garden of Eden

But in a way, many of our “sins” caused less by an apple but more of the sheer horrors of the instincts built into us by “intelligent design” have actually made it so that we can achieve CHIM

Remember Lorkhan/Shor/Shezzar/Talos/etc loves us and Earth is a testing ground and we are superior to angels in our weakness

Communism only works for insect colonies pretty much.

Reminds me of Starship Troopers, apparently Heinlein made the Bugs as sort of based on the Chinese Communists, because to him the CCP was even way more callous with killing enemies and using up their own people and the Bugs were EVOLVED to be better with “communism” than the hypercompetitive humans
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
Maybe it was better for everyone to exist in sheer “innocence” and be stuck at a Hunter-Gatherer or mostly Gatherer life in that Garden of Eden

But in a way, many of our “sins” caused less by an apple but more of the sheer horrors of the instincts built into us by “intelligent design” have actually made it so that we can achieve CHIM

Remember Lorkhan/Shor/Shezzar/Talos/etc loves us and Earth is a testing ground and we are superior to angels in our weakness
Why are you combining Christianity, Elder Scrolls and Scientific ideas here?
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Why are you combining Christianity, Elder Scrolls and Scientific ideas here?

Because Lucifer/Serpent of the Garden of Eden/Satan are alongside other angels “Sons of God” who were once Gods of other religions and there exists the Godhead in the Aurbis and the Daedra/Aedra are God/Saints

And reality itself’s past is both mythical and scientific at the same time and can be explained with Dragonbreaks having likely occurred

Lucifer/Serpent of the Garden of Eden/Satan or Shezzar/Lorkhan/Talos/Man-God brought us out of stasis/eden so that we may truly ascend reality through hardship and being exposed to temptations are a sideeffect and part of the trial to our ascendance

I truly believe if God exists, he is also most definitely a “caring” version of Azathoth and the origin of life involved “Angels” losing a good portion of their power to be eventually used to create the material that became organic life and humans
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
Because Lucifer/Serpent of the Garden of Eden/Satan are alongside other angels “Sons of God” who were once Gods of other religions and there exists the Godhead in the Aurbis and the Daedra/Aedra are God/Saints

And reality itself’s past is both mythical and scientific at the same time and can be explained with Dragonbreaks having likely occurred

Lucifer/Serpent of the Garden of Eden/Satan or Shezzar/Lorkhan/Talos/Man-God brought us out of stasis/eden so that we may truly ascend reality through hardship and being exposed to temptations are a sideeffect and part of the trial to our ascendance
So have you created a religion based on Elder Scrolls lore now?
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
So have you created a religion based on Elder Scrolls lore now?

No, I think I was just spazzing out there or something

That said, if I were to believe in God, it wouldn’t exactly be God like traditional religions

Also, I’m sort of the ethical hedonist, so I kinda also protest to parts of conservatism and think there needs to be an alternative belief than two kinds of things that will repress people’s joys and freedoms
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
No, I think I was just spazzing out there or something

That said, if I were to believe in God, it wouldn’t exactly be God like traditional religions

Also, I’m sort of the ethical hedonist, so I kinda also protest to parts of conservatism
I see. I'm no Conservative myself but simply believe that liberals fighting leftism is foolhardy as they will eventually adopt leftism values and impose it on the rest of us. That has been the pattern so far.

Also, just pointing out that so called Conservative parties are really just leftist lite.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
I see. I'm no Conservative myself but simply believe that liberals fighting leftism is foolhardy as they will eventually adopt leftism values and impose it on the rest of us. That has been the pattern so far.

Also, just pointing out that so called Conservative parties are really just leftist lite.

Okay

Though I gotta say I do believe in a sort of Civic Nationalism being a thing

And that people being tolerant does not necessarily result in the slippery slope for all that leads to totalitarianism

If anything, I think too many people forget that the USSR was screwing over the West for awhile, if anything Far Leftism isn’t a natural consequence, its the result of too many decades of indoctrination

By constantly bringing up race, people end up in tribes

However


Pretty soon you end up uniting people under something like a shared love....god the Far Left may try taking credit for a Black Republican President somehow
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
Okay

Though I gotta say I do believe in a sort of Civic Nationalism being a thing

And that people being tolerant does not necessarily result in the slippery slope for all that leads to totalitarianism
Maybe, maybe not. At this point it doesn't really matter, what was warned about has happened.

If anything, I think too many people forget that the USSR was screwing over the West for awhile, if anything Far Leftism isn’t a natural consequence, its the result of too many decades of indoctrination
Sure. But leftism has been doing crazy shit for years. Need only look at the French Revolution for that or when they took over Russia.

By constantly bringing up race, people end up in tribes
The Left constantly bring it up. It has been a policy of theirs. I watched them discuss this shit even before 2016.

However


Pretty soon you end up uniting people under something like a shared love....god the Far Left may try taking credit for a Black Republican President somehow
Its what they do best. Rewrite the narrative.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Its what they do best. Rewrite the narrative.

It’s almost as obnoxious as the USSR trying to say it built up the West or the infrastructure of the Anti-Communists....by being the “rival” that kept em all together and building up infrastructure and technology and economies to avoid temptation to Communism and have the stuff needed for a war with the help of the nations being developed with US Trade Relations and such
 
It’s almost as obnoxious as the USSR trying to say it built up the West or the infrastructure of the Anti-Communists....by being the “rival” that kept em all together and building up infrastructure and technology and economies to avoid temptation to Communism and have the stuff needed for a war with the help of the nations being developed with US Trade Relations and such


I think part of that is deep down A LOT of people belive in leftism ideals....to serve them. Big goverment is good....so long as I control it. Down with free speech....as long as it's my enemies' speech. and as such people won't try to slow it down. If anything they will try to implment it for themselves. Look at people's reaction toward CHAZ.
 

StormEagle

Well-known member
Because Lucifer/Serpent of the Garden of Eden/Satan are alongside other angels “Sons of God” who were once Gods of other religions and there exists the Godhead in the Aurbis and the Daedra/Aedra are God/Saints

And reality itself’s past is both mythical and scientific at the same time and can be explained with Dragonbreaks having likely occurred

Lucifer/Serpent of the Garden of Eden/Satan or Shezzar/Lorkhan/Talos/Man-God brought us out of stasis/eden so that we may truly ascend reality through hardship and being exposed to temptations are a sideeffect and part of the trial to our ascendance

I truly believe if God exists, he is also most definitely a “caring” version of Azathoth and the origin of life involved “Angels” losing a good portion of their power to be eventually used to create the material that became organic life and humans

...I think I just legitimately had an aneurysm trying to understand this post.
 

Harlock

I should have expected that really
As explained in the video, the Tories have done nothing about Immigration and its apparently higher now then before. And the video attributes this to Tories being paid and supported by corporations who support leftism cause profits. Your own post has it that the Tories mean to just change as little as possible and since unchecked Immigration was ongoing, they just left it as is betraying the people that voted for them.

It's down to the UK still existing under EU rules until Brexit is concluded in January. Until then immigration follows EU rules including free movement of persons within the EU.
New points based rules will come into effect January 2021 designed to cut immigration and return jobs to UK citizens rather than bringing in cheap foreign labour. The policy specifically excludes low skilled workers and freelancers.

Immigration has been on a downward average for the last 10 years or so, but it has spiked recently as people try to get in before January arrives and it all shuts down.
 

Cherico

Well-known member
It's down to the UK still existing under EU rules until Brexit is concluded in January. Until then immigration follows EU rules including free movement of persons within the EU.
New points based rules will come into effect January 2021 designed to cut immigration and return jobs to UK citizens rather than bringing in cheap foreign labour. The policy specifically excludes low skilled workers and freelancers.

Immigration has been on a downward average for the last 10 years or so, but it has spiked recently as people try to get in before January arrives and it all shuts down.

the UK screwed itself over by not getting out sooner the longer they dragged it out the less leverage they had.
 

Harlock

I should have expected that really
the UK screwed itself over by not getting out sooner the longer they dragged it out the less leverage they had.

Probably, but that is mainly down to the EU changing the goalposts during negotiations and asking for increasingly absurd concessions.
By most accounts the UK had a good position at the start but internal divisions and a weak PM hurt the negotiating team, the EU couldn't believe May actually gave them anything over Northern Ireland for instance.
That emboldened them, they asked for more, changed the deals on offer to become more unpalatable, and now will almost certainly get no deal unless national EU governments reign them in.

The UK has been pretty consistent, it started with wanting a good deal but when the EU said a Canada style deal was the only option that is what the deal became. Only for the EU to then refuse a Canadian deal and start trying to assume greater control. plain bad faith, and of course this isn't the only example.

Well on their head be it, they run a £95 billion surplus on UK trade which is going to hurt when it vanishes
 

Doomsought

Well-known member
the UK screwed itself over by not getting out sooner the longer they dragged it out the less leverage they had.
Not exactly, the problem was that while the UK has ton's of leverage it was crippled by a bureaucratic class that considers themselves EU citizens rather than UK citizens. The UK has Gibraltar, which is a trump card that could completely reverse things if the EU wasn't bluffing about cutting off all trade with the UK.

The UK has all kinds of leverage, they just aren't willing to use it because of a false sense of decorum forced on them. The same double standard of etiquette that is used on Republicans across the pond.
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
It's down to the UK still existing under EU rules until Brexit is concluded in January. Until then immigration follows EU rules including free movement of persons within the EU.
New points based rules will come into effect January 2021 designed to cut immigration and return jobs to UK citizens rather than bringing in cheap foreign labour. The policy specifically excludes low skilled workers and freelancers.

Immigration has been on a downward average for the last 10 years or so, but it has spiked recently as people try to get in before January arrives and it all shuts down.
Possible but the Conservatives are apparently trying to hide the immigration terribly at any rate and even that Nigel fellow tried to expose it.

Never mind that if you accept this video by the Sargon fellow who goes on a rant about how the Uk government despite Tories leading it supports BLM and Critical Race theory and not banning it unlike Trump:

 

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