What If? What if Dune style Shields were created tomorrow?

Val the Moofia Boss

Well-known member
So what about things like cane swords, those are elegant and stylish, yet can also be subtle so it's like the premodern version of concealed carry lol.

I don't think concealment will be a problem like it is today.

Today, you have heavy gun regulation... that is unenforced outside of cities. No one cares if you walk around Barstow California with a gun, and the police certainly aren't going to try to take your guns. Gun culture is pretty strong in the US; if the government passed a law forbidding guns, it wouldn't be enforced outside of the cities, because the police know if they tried to enter your house to take your guns, they would be shot. But people don't really walk around with guns because they aren't fashionable. People don't go around wearing holstered guns for show, unless they are doing a Wild West reenactment or something.

Swords are fashionable to wear even just for show. Even today they are very popular in modern culture., ubiquitous in games and movies and TV and books and comics and art. There is a niche industry that produces and sells swords - real and based on fantasy - to people to just hang on their walls, or treat as toys, or to even try to use practically. And there is the HEMA movement, which has been gaining more popularity.

If personal shields exist, and they were affordable and common enough for regular people to get them, then everyone will try to get one. Which means guns will go out the window as a self defense weapon. The people who practically carried handguns to protect themselves, and had shotguns at home, will switch over to carrying swords. And they will be joined by the sword enthusiasts and sword weebs who already exist. With that large starter population getting the ball rolling, normies will follow suit.


A sword culture might lead to fewer homicides. Today, with guns, it is very easy to be a newb, acquire a gun, pop someone you don't like a few times from a distance until they stop making noise, and then run off and get away. And you won't have any blood on your body.

It's hard to do that with a sword. You have to get up close to them, which means putting yourself in danger, and it makes it hard to get in a surprise attack. Even if you do get in a surprise attack, unless you are really good, your first strike probably won't immediately silence them. It will take more time to silence them, hacking away at them. There is going to be screaming, and there is going to be blood on you, and it's going to be a generally unpleasant affair. And your chances of escape will be slim. Furthermore, people will be hesitant to fight, because they won't know the skill level of the other person. People are hesitant to put their lives on the line for an uncertain outcome, especially if there is a very high risk of dying.

Dueling culture could see a revival as well. It somewhat lives on today in the American South with "fighting word laws", where people would fight to defend their or someone else's honor. It meant that there were consequences for what you said, and thus Southern culture was very polite, and is more polite today than other areas of the US. If a large percentage of the populace owned swords, I'd imagine that would make people less hesitant to just blurt out random crap, and their words would be more calculated.


For those reasons, I don't think there would be much correlation between concealed swords and homicides. Serious assassins and would-be-murderers would prefer to use more efficient weapons. Less time to kill. Less noise. Less blood. Stuff like poison darts, or choking people to death, or gas, or poison in food, etc.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Except thermobaric warheads - chemical warheads would be mass-used,too.If enemy created elite units with swords,many ruthless commanders would use it even if their own troops would be in range.They would be cut down anyway,so why bother ?
 

Bassoe

Well-known member
instead using a bulldozer blade or the like
Mine flails.
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Doomsought

Well-known member
Remember, that the reason ranged combat went out of favor was not because shields could no-sell guns.
It was because the shields tended to explode when they were defeated, and the explosions got to the level of a small nuke with reasonably portable shields.

So basically, the real problem is not just breaking the shields, but breaking them without setting off the incidental dead man's switch.

You should be able to modify a shield generator in such a way that it disrupts shields rather than creates them. This will probably be too expensive to be used as a perpetrator for anything other than anti-material munitions.

The shields blow up like nukes thing probably developed after computers became haram, so nobody could figure out how to create a penatrator after brute force was no longer a realistic option.
 

bintananth

behind a desk
I think there is something everyone is forgetting: Dune-style shields can not stop an angry child throwing things during a temper tantrum.

We ain't stupid and, if we have to, will figure out how to breach them from a distance because "up close and personal" is the exact opposite of how we evolved to fight.
 

King Arts

Well-known member
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We have a problem.
I don’t think a regular pen laser would cause that. Since lasers are just light and shields don’t explode when people stand in the sun. Either it affects lasguns because those lasers are powerful or lasguns work on some different mechanics.

I think there is something everyone is forgetting: Dune-style shields can not stop an angry child throwing things during a temper tantrum.

We ain't stupid and, if we have to, will figure out how to breach them from a distance because "up close and personal" is the exact opposite of how we evolved to fight.
A shield can stop things that a child throws if it’s set low enough. The only way to get through a shield is by going slow enough.
 

ShieldWife

Marchioness
So we should assume that lashings from Dune work differently from real world lasers. Otherwise this scenario would be about mass producing nuclear weapons in addition to just the shields.

So the shields don’t cause an explosion from lasers. Then what happens if you should through one with a real laser? Does it block the laser or let it through? It lets light through, otherwise the wearers couldn’t see. This could be a weakness of the shields and a reason for us to develop more efficient laser weapons.

There are all sorts of ways that shields might be overcome and the creation of shields will push innovation. There will be all kinds of slow moving projectiles that carry lethal capabilities: acid, poison, electrical charges, etc.

Does sound penetrate a shield? Does heat? It seems like both have to. Explosions that superheat the air around the victim might be a good way to kill people. The shrapnel and blast wave is stopped by the shield, but the heat gets through.

One huge issue that the Dune books and movies virtually ignore is armor. When shields block fast moving attacks, then armor only has to block slow moving attacks which it is much better at doing. Equipping the warriors in chain mail should be enough to protect them from the slow blade attacks we see in movies. In fact, in the recent Dune movie they wear armor and it shouldn’t actually seem to help.
 

Es Arcanum

Princeps Terra
Founder
Shield tech combined with actual armour and the speed limitations of strikes would make most bladed weapons ineffective. Yes swords too.

One big issue I have with the Dune universe on screen is the seeming lack of armour. That would stop most of the bladed weapons we see in their tracks. The armour we do see on the Sardaukar seems to be of movie Gondorian quality or strangely weak at the neck.

Against properly used shield and armour defences worn by soldiers we'd probably see shaped explosive charges either on sticks/spears/poles or drones.

Get in close, get past your opponents defensive efforts (which may include an actual shield, shield) and stab your opponent with an explosive tipped implement that goes off and blows a hole through their armour (and them) on contact.

I suppose poison could also be used but that could raise other issues and you'd still have to get through the armour.
 

Scottty

Well-known member
Founder
It's all very well to say that shields block bullets, but all that kinetic energy still has to go somewhere. I don't think a Fremen with a wearable shield would still be standing there after he got staffed by Mr BRRRRRT!

Or one just fires rockets at the ground he's standing on.

The Dune universe, as I think has been pointed out, looks like someone gave humanity an idiot ball.
 

Bassoe

Well-known member
...all that kinetic energy still has to go somewhere. I don't think a Fremen with a wearable shield would still be standing there after he got staffed by Mr BRRRRRT!

Or one just fires rockets at the ground he's standing on.
Mine flail tanks.
 

Es Arcanum

Princeps Terra
Founder
I really liked how the sandworm attacks were shown to vibrate the ground so much that people started sinking into it. That was a nice touch and another interesting method of getting around the shield.

Btw what was that weapon the Saudauker were using at the weather station that was shooting through the door?
 

The Whispering Monk

Well-known member
Osaul
Does it block the laser or let it through?
Light is modulated enough to blur sight a bit. The effect is less for the wearer as he's embedded in the field.

Does sound penetrate a shield?
Similar reaction to light. Sound is modulated by the shield, and it does not come through the same way. Dune mentions that there were efforts to disable a shield through sound, but came to naught because it's ridiculously difficult to get the wavelengths tuned just right in addition to being extremely energy intensive.

I really liked how the sandworm attacks were shown to vibrate the ground so much that people started sinking into it. That was a nice touch and another interesting method of getting around the shield.

Sand 'liquification' explains how the sandworms move through the desert so quickly.
 

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