CarlManvers2019
Writers Blocked Douchebag
Try calling Heinlein a Nazi and he'll weird you out with his surprisingly progressive views and stuff to do with sex and multi ethnicity
Starship Troopers general thread
- Thread starter Husky_Khan
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Try calling Heinlein a Nazi and he'll weird you out with his surprisingly progressive views and stuff to do with sex and multi ethnicity
Navarro
Well-known member
He couldn't even get past the opening chapter of SST.
Shipmaster Sane
You have been weighed
I would argue that the film works well on a political-philosophy level as well, just not the way the creator hoped. See, unbeknownst to him having scenery chewing actors shout objectively correct things that you find offensive, without any kind of counter point or strawman-distortion of those ideas, doesn't actually make those ideas or characters look bad. Instead of a parody of fascism we just got a world where everyone was right but very loud.
Navarro
Well-known member
I mean, the only bone the "it's a genius satire" guys have to work with is the fan theory that the meteorite strike the bugs caused was actually done by the TF ... which is hinted at nowhere in the film.
Navarro
Well-known member
Apparently some of them also argue that the film is IU propaganda by the TF ... despite IU propaganda/news being clearly distinguished from "reality".
Lanmandragon
Well-known member
They're just pissy because deep inside themselves in a place ideology can't reach. A place formed by millions of years of evolutionary competition. They can't help but feel elation and pride directly caused by the film. Deep inside thier pshyche is the very real fact. That these "macho" displays mean power,women, wealth, and of course power. Basically thier dicks get hard and thier beliefs say that shouldn't happen. So they've got to justify those feelings somehow.
Would you like to know more?
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Shipmaster Sane
You have been weighed
Careful.
I just realized its topics like these covering its return to Netflix that have created a bit of Media Buzz about Starship Troopers now. The Verge, Screen Rant (I had no idea they did actual articles, I just know them for their Movie Pitch comedy videos) Guardian and even the f'ing New Yorker all have articles recently about the 'legacy' of Starship Troopers and of course they all (probably, I haven't actually read all of them... or most of them... or much of any of them) talk and praise the presentation of "fascist satire" within and inevitably relate it to the modern day or whatever nonsense.
But there's a bigger issue, all of this buzz might actually cause Hollywood to decide to remake this movie, which considering how well Hollywood did in adapting Paul Verhoeven's other works, Robocop and Total Recall, whose original 80's film releases were very well regarded by audiences and critics, that it might make any Starship Troopers remake almost guaranteed to be incredibly terrible and stain the previous fine products of this franchise.
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Also a Starship Troopers game triailer. Looks like a strategy/tactical style game kinda like They Are Billions.
Navarro
Well-known member
I mean, if Verhoeven wanted to actually paint the TF in a darker light he could have replaced that inane detour with the flying bugs with the attack on the Skinnies, which has them attacking an alien city and casually lobbing nukes at factory districts in what's explicitly described as a "terror raid" ...
Yeah, that's been in the works for a while. I have my doubts, as far as I can tell the devs behind it have never done a 3D game, and while thier pervious titles are well regarded, they're also niche titles that don't really overlap with what TC is trying to do.
The differences arise heavily from the fact that the movie was written as an independent science fiction project, then retroactively revised into a very loose adaptation of Starship Troopers after the studio acquired the rights.
The book has its own idiosyncratic absurdities; the minimally fleshed out references to the history of the Terran Federation suggest that the previous society collapsed primarily because a ruling cabal of social workers and child psychologists banned corporal punishment, a move which single-handedly caused a vast crime epidemic that destabilized global society.
One of the key elements of the society that Heinlein created in Starship Troopers is very easy to miss because it's only mentioned in a couple of sentences: Federal Service is always some form of civil service, but it is not necessarily military service. The purpose of Federal Service is that a citizen is required to demonstrate commitment and dedication to society in order to earn the right to participate in decision making for society, but military service is only one of many ways in which that can be done.
If anything, it's a very interesting application of the Eastern concept of sacrificing for the collective harmony and benefit of society, reformulated in a Western cultural setting.
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Yinko
Well-known member
So... he was a prophet of our times?
You see that in a lot of science fiction where the author doesn’t really understand how the military, specifically the officer core and NCOS, work.
They just think because you’re a Major you must know more about this subject then a Sgt or it’s because you were so awesome! Despite that’s really not how it works.
Not even just parodies. Sometimes I just think, “yes and that’s bad why?”
Take the movie, as mentioned you can be rich as hell, shit talk the gov, have a good life and not be a citizen. There doesn’t seem to be a massive slum.
Most people don’t even vote or follow politics so there really wouldn’t be much of a difference for them. Most would hardly even notice and if they wanted to vote they could serve and get it.
It’s cheesy but I could easily see myself living happily in Starship Troopers the movie verse, at least in the first one. What’s even more funny is how progressive it is without being sjw.
We see female military officers/enlisted treated the same as the males and even carrying their own weight.I don’t remember a hint of racism. The Sky Marshal that takes over doesn’t degrade the last one for being a man and say she’d do it better because she’s a black woman. She clearly states her plan, which is learn about the enemy because we can’t repeat mistakes and it’s a good plan.
No sex is shown to be stupider then the others. Yes, Carmen is a pilot but that was because she put her nose to grind in school and Rico didn’t. Not because she’s a woman and he’s a man. Despite that start he still rose to lead and is considered a poster boy like Carmen.
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Argent
Well-known member
A lot of of Heinlein's book are surprising equal in their treatment of the sexes. Overall a lot of Heinlein's explorations are what beatniks and the hippies said they supported.
But in all his books some things are consent like working for the betterment of society as a whole. Even in books like Moon is a Harsh Mistrees there is a lot of talk about volunteering to help society as a whole even as it pushes the frontier spirit.
But in all his books some things are consent like working for the betterment of society as a whole. Even in books like Moon is a Harsh Mistrees there is a lot of talk about volunteering to help society as a whole even as it pushes the frontier spirit.
Navarro
Well-known member
And what's really hilarious is how Verhoeven says "it's only fucking good for killing bugs"!
This society is meant to be dystopic? Ironically Heinlein is a bit more weird about this, with his 100% female space navy ...
Yinko
Well-known member
Interesting. They really did create a fantastic propaganda piece... for the side they meant to demonize.
I suspect that Heinlein's thing about the female navy was due to the general idea against having women be front line combatants. It's still kind of a thing, given the double standard in the fitness tests. More likely, knowing Heinlein and the fact that he was a Navy man himself, he was just thinking of all those horny buzz-cut women in tight jump suits.
Navarro
Well-known member
Major violation of show, don't tell.
Heh. It also adds another wrinkle into the Sky Marshal promotion track ...
Bear Ribs
Well-known member
I know the perception that women would be better in space was common in that era, attributed to the relatively smaller body size and muscle mass requiring less oxygen, water, space, and food compared to a male, who'd be dragging along a larger body that wasn't needed when robots do the heavy lifting.
Doomsought
Well-known member
Starship Troopers predicted the exact social troubles we are suffering right now.
CarlManvers2019
Writers Blocked Douchebag
Except instead of an entire generation of teenagers being the ones doing all the trouble
You got teenagers to middle aged douchebags who are confident they won't face consequences due to not being punished much whilst younger and being indoctrinated whilst also being praised and rewarded for what is taught as being "good" like bullying someone online to death for saying something "offensive" once