Let's face it, they were going to do that anyways.
You know what? Good.
With that attitude, certainly. But it's not the job of US foreign policy makers to doom, but to try their best.
EU got humbled with the east making the west eat crow over Russia, and Iran is a separate matter where there is a genuine mismatch of priorities and alliances in ME.
A lot of the "peacemakers" and greens had to eat crow after their Russia dependency and green policy bit them in the ass, there is a unprecedented opportunity follow up on that blow and push the EU in a different direction.
Japan siding with China is, yes less likely... than everyone having to give their answers on how do they feel about a massive amount of worldwide nuclear weapon proliferation in the next 2 decades.
You mean the single QE the Brits have visiting Japan?
Yeah, I know you think that Europe can tariff US goods and play nice with the CCP, and not have any repercussions from the US, and that the US imposing it's own tariffs to help the US worker is a 'betrayal'/'bad geopolitics'.
Guess what, unless Ukraine gets France to fight for them, they aren't getting those territories back, militarily or diplomatically.
Oh please, sure they do, they just chose not to, because having deniable assets attack Trump and try to engage in public influence campaigns against him is something that many in UA and the EU cheer on, where they don't think conservative Americans can see it.
No, the implication is Trump isn't going to take military action unless he doesn't have a choice, because the people who elected him are not in the mood for more foreign interventions or 'forever wars' of dragging out conflicts indefinitely, which is what Ukraine appears to be becoming. And the Pentagon attempting to go around Trump or ignore Trump, will just see massive numbers of officers fired.
If the EU hadn't been playing nice with Russia for a while, they wouldn't be in a position to have done what they did to Ukraine.
The thing you miss is that context has changed, and is different now, thanks to Biden's stupidity and the EU's own unwillingness to fully fund NATO, as well as the CCP upping the time table on Taiwan.
We agree on something? Didn't see that
Then again you demonstrate that you have no clue about the military stuff and you should do research before making sweeping statements like this..
Well if US administration is more interested in giving sweetheart deals to enemies than to allies while making demands on allies, this is the absurd situation you get...
Self fulfilling prophecy - not with that attitude for sure.
Their demographics are no worse than those of many other US allies, including the rich Asian ones (don't make Koreans sweat about their US alliance they have enough on their minds), or China's for that matter, so better leave that point alone.
What fucking leverage? Zelensky nor Ukraine have no interest in self-delusion, they are too close to the reality of the conflict.
www.newsweek.com
If they do, what is it? These people are just local leftists adding yet another flag to their bio, as you can outright see on theirs often. Many people in EU, and almost all in UA have as much idea about US politics as they do about Japanese ones, if not less, because what little they do know is probably from CNN.
If you are going to base your geostrategy on fickle moods of clueless people, then you are going to lose any geopolitical conflict against anyone capable of manipulating and/or exploiting those moods by default.
If so, that's an indication that USA wants to be out, period, and should make it official and openly hand the farce of peace negotiations to the EU to do with it as they please, instead of leading desperate negotiations... something past Trump had something to say about.
libquotes.com
>if
Anything can be declared a no-win situation if you rule out doing any of the actions that could make it a win.
Which is an inherently doomed approach. Russia is perfectly willing and able to refuse any deal it doesn't like, and there you go back to square one. Either you have the will to let the war continue if Russia is unwilling to back down enough... or just want to conditionally surrender Ukraine and we're just trying to fish for sufficiently copeable sounding conditions that Russia will be free to twist to own benefit, might as well call it Minsk 3 scenario.
EU is finally increasing military funding now, so it's a terrible moment for such arguments, especially if you would hope for some of that funding to be aimed at Pacific too.
Plainly wrong assertion. US resources are perfectly sufficient to change conditions on the ground, and without even significantly affecting the supplies needed for Pacific war scenarios. Like the previousoly mentioned F-16's and other aircraft and vehicles not suitable for island warfare. Some of them probably going to end up scrapped even.
And it's an obvious strategic mistake to think like this.
And? If a war in Pacific happens, well, the further events are under no obligation to follow cinematic rules. In no way it will mean nothing can happen in Europe because the camera is on Asia. It may well turn out that this will be exactly the moment for Russia to take the opportunity to break any deal made, or even escalate against Baltics or Caucasus knowing USA is busy.
Japan, who is co-producing AMRAAMs and SM-6s now, and actually has a military that matters in the Pacific.
Oh yes, the US finally leveling tariffs on nations that have tariffed the US is so very wrong and bad, in your eyes and the eyes of much of the EU, fucking lol.
And that isn't going to happen, because Putin knows the US's playbooks for trying to forment unrest inside Russia itself, and that's part of why he's leaning on the Norks, where the US has even less ability to play domestic fuck-fuck games.
Rich Asian allies who also usually are island nations, and amphib operations are much trickier and more costly than anything Russia is attempting to do in Ukraine, after the initial push. And S. Korea is nearly the definition of a 'defensive turtle' done right, and operates with expectations of it's own manpower issues.
Russia has leverage in that they are still supplying the US with uranium and some processed nuclear materials, which have not been sanctioned, and which (thanks to Jimmy Carter) the US doesn't process or make ourselves anymore.What fucking leverage? Zelensky nor Ukraine have no interest in self-delusion, they are too close to the reality of the conflict.
Russia is being outright cheeky that they don't hesitate seizing shit from US businesses and USA is not going to do anything more than it already does about it. If it was going to do anything, we would not be talking about another Russia reset or peace deals, or at least return of all US business' property would be part of the conditions.Russia seizes US company's soup to feed soldiers: Report
Russia's government seized Russian-based assets of several foreign companies, placing them under the Kremlin's "temporary management"
Until then, such leverage exists only in the dimension of potentials and theories, rather than reality, and we can all see what Russian leadership thinks of those theories and potentials.
So you want to ignore the stuff DOGE found about USAID operations being used by Ukraine to push shit that attacked Trump and the GOP/MAGA?
Dismissing US domestic concerns as 'clueless people', then you are very much showing the why people in the US have stopped caring what Europe thinks of the US.
No, the people who are desperate and fucking up negotiations is Ukraine, thanks to Zelensky's fuck up in the Oval Office.If so, that's an indication that USA wants to be out, period, and should make it official and openly hand the farce of peace negotiations to the EU to do with it as they please, instead of leading desperate negotiations... something past Trump had something to say about.
Donald Trump Quote
The worst thing you can possibly do in a deal is seem desperate to make it. That makes the other guy smell blood, and then you're dead. The best thing you can do is deal from strength, and leverage is the biggest strength you can ...
If EU hadn't been two-faced about Russia, while also shitting on the US worker at the same times as importing jihadi's to displace/replace their own domestic population, and actually paying for NATO at the level's expected, things would be much different.
Dude, your unwillingness to deal with realities that do not fit your preferred worldviews is not my problem.
No, it is an approach that realizes we have to find a way to live with Russia, because destroying them isn't an option, and that means not pretending Ukraine has leverage or geopolitical positioning that it simply doesn't.
Given the timeline for a fight with the CCP has been upped to likely within this year, not 2027, I don't think any increase in EU military spending now will have much effect in the decisive first battles, or have even cleared the full Eu bureacratic shuffle by the time the CCP goes for Taiwan.
Again, the US has uses for those F-16s in the Pacific too, even if you tried to wave it off last time I pointed it out.
Russia has reasons to accept a deal it doesn't like, if it gets Russia access back into things like SWIFT, and easing sanctions on it's oil sector, as well as getting US help rebuilding refineries hit by UA.
Yes, we know they will likely work together, and that Russia may do something while Taiwan is being hit; never said otherwise.
Russia 'crashing and burning' to the degree you want isn't going to happen short of a nuclear war or your fanciful idea of a Russian domestic uprising, neither of which the US is pushing for.
Russia doesn't want peace
Yeah, Japan, the country famously in blockade *and* missile range of China, surely it will have loads of missile production, not just for own needs, but with enough surplus to even sell to allies during that war, do you even read the stuff you write?
How the fuck in the name of Davy Jones do you expect China to do submarine operations not just in the Pacific, but even the Atlantic? If i read that in a fiction book i would be leaving a scathing review about how unrealistic that is.
No, that's not sweetheard deals, that's ridiculous doomerism.
>EU abusing US workers
What you call realities are a fictional world of demoralization propaganda by West's enemies. Get a fucking grip or stop humiliating yourself at least. You're sounding like one of the RUSSIA STRONK people now.
Blockade operations even by third rate powers on the other hand are incredibly hard to counter, as US Navy is finding out right now in ME, and that's a prime area for them. No defensive turtle can fight without fuel, food and ammo at very least.
No, they certainly suffer from completely different issues, and will only figure out what those are exactly once they... you know, take part in their first wars since many, many decades.
Wrong. Better surety of indefinite fighting than delusions grounded in bullshit under a Damocles sword of Russian hybrid warfare techniques (tell me with a straight face they will stop and won't use the fragile deal to push them further).
More pure propaganda bullshit. You should feel ashamed. That's above all an artifact of nuclear deals from after Cold War.
Which obviously means a loss of revenue for the US government for no gain at all. Good luck funding a navy expansion against China with that big, fat nothing. It's basically indirect donation by US government to Russian one in that case.
Since when Ukrainian government had any control over a part of US government and private organizations it funds and so carries any responsibility for it?
Yes, sometimes people have concerns, and sometimes the concerns are retarded and the people who bring them up are also retarded. We point out leftist concerns being examples of this every day out here, so i don't see why your rhetorical maneuvers with such terms should be taken at face value. Better start being concerned about what US stock market thinks if you absolutely need to be concerned about something.
Well duh, media get to decide who's synonymous with corruption. Taiwan and South Korea both have some quite weird stuff politically, but we both know that historically if USA didn't let that shit fly it would be left with no allies in general.
True, the situation will be far worse when Pacific goes hot, and the market for excuses will be even bigger.
The Oval Office slapfight is meaningless in strategic terms and if Zelensky was desperate he would have accepted all the shit terms being proposed a long time ago.
This has nothing to do with hate or any other emotions, those are stories for naive TV gazers.
The situation does not revolve around Trump and his thoughts. It started before him, and it will likely persist long after him.
Fuck off from using EU domestic matters as excuses, lest you want EU to stick its nose into US domestic debates about guns, race politics, healthcare and immigration too when China starts making trade deals.
Didn't you forget US complaints that EU has not enough free speech and now you complain that the free speech is of wrong kind?
Well if you're gonna listen to them and accept it as truth, then nothing Europe does matters, they are perfectly willing and able to invent convenient for themselves narratives anyway. RT made plenty of equally unflattering materials about USA too, especially during the "summer of love", you probably saw those too, but let's not talk about that because it doesn't fit your half assed narrative.
No, Russia is able to do effective influence ops everywhere, and just like you find excuses wherever you need them, they find materials to support excuses.
Dude, your willingness to imagine fictions that fit your pre-ordained political camp's mandate and mistake them for reality is not my problem.
It surely is unlikely to happen if everyone who wants it to happen would adopt the doomerist attitude you propose.
Reason number who the fuck counts anymore to work on US public's socio-psychological weaknesses that stopped it from driving wars to total victory since WW2. Better try it before the China war, because China is known for its patience, and has deeper pockets than Russia.
It is not our problem to find a way to live with Russia, it's Russia's problem to find a way to live with the rest of the world.
Walking away from negotiations would be better if the negotiations are going to be what they look like now. If Trump wants Europe to handle all the hard and expensive parts of the next stage of Ukraine situation, it's only fair to simply tell them that openly and let them decide what that stage is going to be called, instead of adding credibility to Russian diplomacy and creating delusions of peace.
If we go with that timeline, then fuck everyone's shipbuilding, no one can build oceanic warships this fast, it's too late for new anything, if you want more ships for Pacific Trump needs to start negotiating *any* kind of "money is of no concern" deal for ships, with EU naval powers and fast, be it with crews or as sale or lend lease doesn't matter, instead of pissing them off with tariffs and Russia coddling.
Which i did not wave off, i pointed out that it is logistically untenable beyond few hundreds at most. What about the other thousands?
A statement GRU would sign off on gladly and ok to show on RT, presented by a Russian military expert proceeding to talk about how much western military equipment sucks.
No use for most of it... and consider what sort of gear USA is willing to sell to middle eastern third world countries where Chinese military attaches can certainly get a close look for a small bribe to Iranian friends (look up who bought tricked out F-15's recently and is eyeing F-35's now), that is an irrelevant concern for the vast majority of things USA is willing to part with at all. That is if they didn't steal the data straight from the manufacturing contractors already even for the non-export stuff.
If Russia considered the losing these as bad enough econmic damage to be worth resigning ambitious war goals to avoid... it would have retired maximalist war goals in 2022 already.
Putin cares about their opinions as much as i care about opinions of peaceniks.
>USA
The EU, alongside China and US, is one of 3 big economic powers of the world. Ignore that very clear, number based reality at your own peril. From its perspective, the events in Pacific will certainly be a sideshow, but if USA keeps loudly declaring that it doesn't need them to help in the more challenging conflict, i think they will oblige it and not help at all.
History demonstrates quite clearly that this can happen, especially in Russia of all places, as it happened long before nukes even existed in many places.
I'm not wish casting, i'm just simply rejecting (and with vicious mockery at that) your utterly delusional judgement regarding what are realities and what are wishes (which conveniently happes to be flavor of the month media narrative of your preferred political option at the moment).
The Trump subjugation of Russia as a new US proxy state is working splendidly:
Putin announces an Easter ceasefire as Russia and Ukraine swap hundreds of POWs
Russian President Vladimir Putin has announced a temporary Easter ceasefire in Ukraine starting Saturday, citing humanitarian reasons.apnews.com
If Trump keeps this up, he's going to make Putin his bitch. Yet another nail in the Liberal Democrat propaganda machine's coffin.
I do not know why I fucking bothered, you will not listen to anything outside your own narrow world view and think being insulting and mocking towards concerns and views shared by many Americans does anything but make them even less likely to give a damn about what you and people like you have to say.Yeah, Japan, the country famously in blockade *and* missile range of China, surely it will have loads of missile production, not just for own needs, but with enough surplus to even sell to allies during that war, do you even read the stuff you write?
How the fuck in the name of Davy Jones do you expect China to do submarine operations not just in the Pacific, but even the Atlantic? If i read that in a fiction book i would be leaving a scathing review about how unrealistic that is.
If that was something China could pull, then that would be a point where you desperately need European aid in reining in the PLAN at least out of oceans where it very much doesn't belong lest you want to be blockaded yourself.
Please continue to compromise all the ideas about global conflicts you have by showing off how utterly clueless you are about the matter.
No, that's not sweetheard deals, that's ridiculous doomerism.
>EU abusing US workers
With what? Competition of its own expensive workforce under welfare state funding taxes?
Have you perhaps mixed up the EU with China or Bangladesh? Are you in need of remedial geography, or read too much Chinese propaganda under different flags?
What you call realities are a fictional world of demoralization propaganda by West's enemies. Get a fucking grip or stop humiliating yourself at least. You're sounding like one of the RUSSIA STRONK people now.
Russian economy cannot survive on morale, propaganda, or overpaid nork surplus artillery shells.
Blockade operations even by third rate powers on the other hand are incredibly hard to counter, as US Navy is finding out right now in ME, and that's a prime area for them. No defensive turtle can fight without fuel, food and ammo at very least.
No, they certainly suffer from completely different issues, and will only figure out what those are exactly once they... you know, take part in their first wars since many, many decades.
I see you are grasping at straws here for an argument but can't find one.
Wrong. Better surety of indefinite fighting than delusions grounded in bullshit under a Damocles sword of Russian hybrid warfare techniques (tell me with a straight face they will stop and won't use the fragile deal to push them further).
Stop trying to inflict purely artificial desperation for time on supposed allies, while knowing that the other side is perfectly fine spending some more time and restarting the war at increasingly better circumstances to win its campaign.
Desperation is best left to enemies.
More pure propaganda bullshit. You should feel ashamed. That's above all an artifact of nuclear deals from after Cold War.
USA of all places has plenty of other sources for those.
Leverage my ass. Russia had much more "leverage" over EU with oil and gas and look how much that's worth.
Why are you so hell bent on salvaging shitlib theories on how trade will totally assure peace with the dictatorship of the world just as the shitlibs had those beaten out of them by Russian military...
Which obviously means a loss of revenue for the US government for no gain at all. Good luck funding a navy expansion against China with that big, fat nothing. It's basically indirect donation by US government to Russian one in that case.
Since when Ukrainian government had any control over a part of US government and private organizations it funds and so carries any responsibility for it?
I don't give a flying fuck about retarded pretzel logic like this. Go back and figure out why that is stupid yourself.
Yes, sometimes people have concerns, and sometimes the concerns are retarded and the people who bring them up are also retarded. We point out leftist concerns being examples of this every day out here, so i don't see why your rhetorical maneuvers with such terms should be taken at face value. Better start being concerned about what US stock market thinks if you absolutely need to be concerned about something.
Well duh, media get to decide who's synonymous with corruption. Taiwan and South Korea both have some quite weird stuff politically, but we both know that historically if USA didn't let that shit fly it would be left with no allies in general.
True, the situation will be far worse when Pacific goes hot, and the market for excuses will be even bigger.
The Oval Office slapfight is meaningless in strategic terms and if Zelensky was desperate he would have accepted all the shit terms being proposed a long time ago.
This has nothing to do with hate or any other emotions, those are stories for naive TV gazers.
This is cold KGB geostrategy.
The situation does not revolve around Trump and his thoughts. It started before him, and it will likely persist long after him.
Fuck off from using EU domestic matters as excuses, lest you want EU to stick its nose into US domestic debates about guns, race politics, healthcare and immigration too when China starts making trade deals.
Didn't you forget US complaints that EU has not enough free speech and now you complain that the free speech is of wrong kind?
And Russia was and is more so, yet that somehow that Very Concerned Populance can easily ignore... because their idiot boxes don't talk about it.
Well if you're gonna listen to them and accept it as truth, then nothing Europe does matters, they are perfectly willing and able to invent convenient for themselves narratives anyway. RT made plenty of equally unflattering materials about USA too, especially during the "summer of love", you probably saw those too, but let's not talk about that because it doesn't fit your half assed narrative.
No, Russia is able to do effective influence ops everywhere, and just like you find excuses wherever you need them, they find materials to support excuses.
Dude, your willingness to imagine fictions that fit your pre-ordained political camp's mandate and mistake them for reality is not my problem.
It surely is unlikely to happen if everyone who wants it to happen would adopt the doomerist attitude you propose.
Yes, i will do worse than dismiss and ignore this self-fulfilling prophecy, i will do anything i can to brutally tear it to shreds.
Self-referantial "this is unlikely to happen so stop supporting it" is completely unimpressive to me. The solution to that is to convince more people to make it happen, especially if the reason given for it not happening is that some people have been told idiotic excuses to not do it.
Reason number who the fuck counts anymore to work on US public's socio-psychological weaknesses that stopped it from driving wars to total victory since WW2. Better try it before the China war, because China is known for its patience, and has deeper pockets than Russia.
If US public is going to keep this utter cultural retardation about "forever wars" as the new sacred cow of its foreign policy, other countries may as well side with the winners instead. Until then, wallowing in successful demoralization measures should be shamed relentlessly.
It is not our problem to find a way to live with Russia, it's Russia's problem to find a way to live with the rest of the world.
It's not about Ukraine, Ukraine is merely a hotspot where the problem is most obvious.
Who even needs to destroy them, let them to continue this for a decade or two, they will destroy themselves, but they need some spears to impale themselves on.
Walking away from negotiations would be better if the negotiations are going to be what they look like now. If Trump wants Europe to handle all the hard and expensive parts of the next stage of Ukraine situation, it's only fair to simply tell them that openly and let them decide what that stage is going to be called, instead of adding credibility to Russian diplomacy and creating delusions of peace.
If we go with that timeline, then fuck everyone's shipbuilding, no one can build oceanic warships this fast, it's too late for new anything, if you want more ships for Pacific Trump needs to start negotiating *any* kind of "money is of no concern" deal for ships, with EU naval powers and fast, be it with crews or as sale or lend lease doesn't matter, instead of pissing them off with tariffs and Russia coddling.
Which i did not wave off, i pointed out that it is logistically untenable beyond few hundreds at most. What about the other thousands?
The reality is that US government needs its old F-16's for Pacific so much that... it's converting more of them into friggin target drones than the total number of aircraft everyone sent to Ukraine.
A statement GRU would sign off on gladly and ok to show on RT, presented by a Russian military expert proceeding to talk about how much western military equipment sucks.
No use for most of it... and consider what sort of gear USA is willing to sell to middle eastern third world countries where Chinese military attaches can certainly get a close look for a small bribe to Iranian friends (look up who bought tricked out F-15's recently and is eyeing F-35's now), that is an irrelevant concern for the vast majority of things USA is willing to part with at all. That is if they didn't steal the data straight from the manufacturing contractors already even for the non-export stuff.
If Russia considered the losing these as bad enough econmic damage to be worth resigning ambitious war goals to avoid... it would have retired maximalist war goals in 2022 already.
Yet here we are. Take your own conclusion out of that.
Mine is that if there is any amount of economic damage Russian leadership considers bad enough to be worth abandoning the war over, it's most certainly not any of the things that already were lost in the beginning of the war, if there is any such line at all, and they aren't simply decided to take their chances, declare full war economy if things get too shaky and proceed deeper into China or even NK style system under excuse of war where the spooks and party hold absolutely all the power. Either they stay in power forever or retire in China or somewhere near with airliners full of treasure if a revolution/civil war drives them out, the rest is details, and having an excuse to not bother with pretending they have a normal economy anymore is more of a feature of the war than a bug for them.
Putin cares about their opinions as much as i care about opinions of peaceniks.
>USA
>controlling ICC warrants
Dude, yet again, you may want to consider researching basic facts before you say something this retarded.
USA has not even ratified the treaty behind ICC, send your thank you's to Bush by the way.
The EU, alongside China and US, is one of 3 big economic powers of the world. Ignore that very clear, number based reality at your own peril. From its perspective, the events in Pacific will certainly be a sideshow, but if USA keeps loudly declaring that it doesn't need them to help in the more challenging conflict, i think they will oblige it and not help at all.
History demonstrates quite clearly that this can happen, especially in Russia of all places, as it happened long before nukes even existed in many places.
I'm not wish casting, i'm just simply rejecting (and with vicious mockery at that) your utterly delusional judgement regarding what are realities and what are wishes (which conveniently happes to be flavor of the month media narrative of your preferred political option at the moment).
We aren't going to fight a war with Russia over Ukraine, that is the long and short of it.
Russia proposed one, broke it right after it went into effect.
And what make you think Russia won't fight us when we fight China?
