Russia(gate/bot) Russia-Ukraine War Political Discussion

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Bacle

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The Poland caught 9 Russians attempting to sabotage railway lines in the country.

Maybe the US should look a little harder at protecting our critical infrastructure from Russian sabotage ops, if they were trying shit in the Poland despite it being in NATO.

Russia already sees itself as at war with NATO and the West in general, maybe it's time for the West to respond openly in a manner Russia actually might pay attention too.
 

Spartan303

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Osaul
You are wrong though; Pence said he would support whatever helped lead to a Ukrainian victory, not just 'peace' aka appeasing Russia with territorial concessions by Ukraine.


Again, this assumes the war is still ongoing by the time Trump gets in office and a peace deal isn't reached and Ukraine hasn't already taken their territory back. Its up in the air as we simply don't know what will happen.

If Trump tries to run on cutting support for Ukraine he will lose

How? People certainly support Ukraines right to self defense, sure. But that only goes so far. Most Americans are not fans of pumping tens of Billions of dollars into a war when gas and basic amenities are rising in price. We cant afford it. And the money would be better spent on cleaning up East Palestine and restoring the farmlands in that area.

Frankly the way the MAGA GOP has continued to shoot itself in the foot regarding Russia's invasion of Ukraine is one of the most shameful things I've ever seen happen in US politics, particulalry when it is turning the 'Trump/Trump supporters support Russia' hoax into reality and showing how much of the Right just operates off contrarian logic more than critical thinking.

How? How is MAGA shooting itself in the foot? Just because Trump supports ending a conflict does not make him a Russian stoog. I thought you were done with the days of the NeoLib/NeoCon warmongering days? You've said as much yourself in the past.
 

Blasterbot

Well-known member
If the economy keeps going how it is do you think people are gonna be a fan of unlimited foreign aid? no they are going to want to focus on domestic issues. we have had financial institutions collapsing for the past couple of months and that is just one part of it. if things keep getting worse then we gonna be more concerned with ourselves.
 

Zachowon

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Trump needs to run on supporting Ukraine if congress decides to help stop other social programs in the US. As well as forcing cingress to agree because either way it will make the dems and rinos look bad if they don't agree
 

Bacle

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Again, this assumes the war is still ongoing by the time Trump gets in office and a peace deal isn't reached and Ukraine hasn't already taken their territory back. Its up in the air as we simply don't know what will happen.
You were the one who said that all the GOP nominees except Pence are for pushing 'peace' deals at this point, which shows the presumptives on the GOP ticket can almost all be expected to be willing to try to bargain with Putin/Russia over the conflict instead of continuing to support Ukraine.

This war is likely to take till after 2024 to conclude, simply due to when mud seasons happen in Ukraine and the impact on armored warfare, as Crimea is the decisive terrain, not the Donbas. I expect most of this year will be focused on retaking Crimea, after which retaking the Donbas could be take most of 2024 and possibly some of 2025.
How? People certainly support Ukraines right to self defense, sure. But that only goes so far. Most Americans are not fans of pumping tens of Billions of dollars into a war when gas and basic amenities are rising in price. We cant afford it. And the money would be better spent on cleaning up East Palestine and restoring the farmlands in that area.
Because it will make the 'Russia collusion/Russian agent' narrative go into overdrive and with legit backing this time, instead of as a hoax.

Also, as for cannot afford it, that's just the old 'fiscal conservatives forget the Fed has infinite money' issue rearing it's head again, and frankly, a lot of the aid money to Ukraine comes back home as weapons and equipment orders from Ukraine.

And Spartan, you know damn well if Russia gets to keep any of Ukraine, they will try again in 5-10 years, and that means another costly war. So eating the costs now to support Ukraine and push Russia back behind it's own borders, instead of trying to penny-pinch when the money already used has show great returns in gutting Russia's military abilities.
How? How is MAGA shooting itself in the foot? Just because Trump supports ending a conflict does not make him a Russian stoog. I thought you were done with the days of the NeoLib/NeoCon warmongering days? You've said as much yourself in the past.
The NeoCons were right about Russia, though, and I've realized that; they may not bat 100% domestically, but they were right about needing to treat Russia as a threat even after the Cold War went into half-time.

And yes, supporting anything other than a Ukrainian victory is going to get someone on the Right labeled a Russia stooge, particularly if said person still thinks they can negotiate with Putin in good faith, or after the ICC warrant went out.
 

Spartan303

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Trump needs to run on supporting Ukraine if congress decides to help stop other social programs in the US. As well as forcing cingress to agree because either way it will make the dems and rinos look bad if they don't agree

No he doesn't. Trump will run on the economy,con dirty politics from the left and on resecuring the border. He will focus on energy independence and rettien of of American industry, manufacturing and steel. He'll focus on restoring sanity after the left has gone off the deep end. And of the Left does something stupid like arrest him on Tuesday. And he will win in a landslide.
 

Agent23

Ни шагу назад!
Are you literally retarded? genuine question here?

I said that issuing a warrant for the arrest of putin is both stupid and pathetic on every possible level.
you strawmanned it as "mrttao says we should let putin do whatever he wants"

Meanwhile I have not made any strawman arguments.
Please show where I misrepresented anything you have said?
1)Except that he has 80% approval and a lot of those that disapprove are pissed because he did not go in hard and did not declare a real war...

2) The Russian Federation is not a signatory to the Rome Statute.
Neither is the USA, by the way.
And also I distinctly remember Tom Kratman explaining a few things about the USA's stance about that bullshit in one book of his.


The USA anonymously voted to
1) Pull out of it.

2) Use military force to liberate any and all of its servicemen that might be imprisoned or held under it.

3) Show the finger to whoever tries to use it against them and view them as a military threat if they tried to aid in it being applied to their people.

:D

Do as I say, not as I do...
 

Zachowon

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No he doesn't. Trump will run on the economy,con dirty politics from the left and on resecuring the border. He will focus on energy independence and rettien of of American industry, manufacturing and steel. He'll focus on restoring sanity after the left has gone off the deep end. And of the Left does something stupid like arrest him on Tuesday. And he will win in a landslide.
That will help.
Hell, if he is smart he can use the Ukraine conflict to boost American industry and would run on durrheeing manufacturing in the US.
To support Ukraine in Arms we need to reestablish out domestic manufacturing and create more jobs and a stronger economy.
Boom.
 

Captain X

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Please include TLDR's for any videos posted. Thanks.
He discusses the warrant for Putin's arrest, engages in a bit of whataboutism, and points out that the warrant doesn't really do much, other than to maybe set Russia up for a way out of this by arresting and giving over Putin themselves (an idea I suggested myself early on as a way out for Russia).
 

AmosTrask

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That will help.
Hell, if he is smart he can use the Ukraine conflict to boost American industry and would run on durrheeing manufacturing in the US.
To support Ukraine in Arms we need to reestablish out domestic manufacturing and create more jobs and a stronger economy.
Boom.
Do you really think Trump will do the logical thing instead of listening to his ego? The man has a pathological need to be the center of attention. Whether it's positive or not.

If he was Trump the Stand-up Comedian it would be perfect. But the man is horribly unsuitable to responsibility and power. His impulsiveness and total lack of tack has caused you Americans a lot of trouble before.
 
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Jormungandr

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Do you really think Trump will do the logical thing instead of listening to his ego? The man has a pathological need to be the center of attention. Whether it's positive or not.

If he was Trump the Stand-up Comedian it would be perfect. But the man is horribly unsuitable to responsibility and power. His impulsiveness and total lack of tack has caused you Americans a lot of trouble before.
Paradoxically, Trump has an ego and makes himself look like a clown pretty much every time he opens his mouth or his fingers touch a keyboard; however, he was also the best President the Yanks had for at least twenty years. He actually got shit done when he wasn't hampered by his own supposed supporters in the White House and military.

People, the living ones anyway, bought into the "TRUMP BAD!" hysteria and voted for a senile old pedophile, one in China's pocket, that has wrecked the country in just one term of office.
 

mrttao

Well-known member
I actually don’t know if nukes would be used if Putin was arrested.
I think you misunderstood the arguments being given.
Nobody is going to actually arrest putin.

If he was arrested obviously they wouldn't fire nukes.
But you can't arrest him while he is inside russia and ruling russia.
To arrest him, he needs to leave russia as a civilian.

The only thing this the warrant does is:
a. virtue signal
b. limit his retirement options.

my opinion is that limiting his ability to retire means his only option is to fight us to the death. At best it does nothing, at worst it is the deciding factor for when he is thinking "do I just give up and retire... or do I press the red button and die in a blaze of glory"

some others are of the opinion that this opinion makes me a vatnik.
and that the warrant was a heavy blow against putin that really really hurt him. (hilarious, I know)
 
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Jormungandr

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Yes. Baseless accusations proven repeatedly to be false. This immediately invalidates everything else in your post. Amigo I work in Romania. I've had to work with or for former Soviet officials enough to know the value of fact checking when it comes to politics and propaganda. This is just lazy
I'm pretty sure Biden sniffing little girls' hair on camera, coupled with a certain diary that they did everything and anything to suppress, as well as him literally babbling like a drunken monkey, and the links to China (especially with his son, Hunter, who has a laptop filled with, let's just say incriminating photos and videos) coming to light, and his actions in basically destroying the American economy and reputation are all pretty self-evident that he's a senile old kiddie-fucker that fucked over the US in just one presidential term.

But, sure. If you want to just dismiss all that as "baseless propaganda", I can pretty say for sure that your post-Soviet bullshit detector that you're so proud of is as broken as Biden's brain.
 

Megadeath

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in China's pocket
So, what's with the dramatic and impactful escalation of the chip war? Why is it that now USA is doing more to show support of Taiwan than basically any time before? Why are the US going in for AUKUS when it pisses China off so much? Why, in fact, are China more pissed at America than any other time in recent memory?
 
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