Mass Effect Vs Battletech.

Kevral

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To be fair long range sniping in big battles like that only really happens when 1 side has a 'stationary' target to protect like a planet, space station etc
 

Aaron Fox

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To be fair long range sniping in big battles like that only really happens when 1 side has a 'stationary' target to protect like a planet, space station etc
Even then, having sniper duels even while one side is pinned would decrease the effective range of the guns if both sides have high acceleration rates...
 

Spartan303

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Osaul
Even then, having sniper duels even while one side is pinned would decrease the effective range of the guns if both sides have high acceleration rates...


Im of the opinion the Star League ships are just advanced enough to be a threat to the Citadel fleet.
 

Aaron Fox

Well-known member
Im of the opinion the Star League ships are just advanced enough to be a threat to the Citadel fleet.
From my understanding, I wouldn't be surprised that Mass Effect combat accelerations topped above 3 or 4 Gs for their heavy hitters.

Given that it is always fluffed that the speeds in the system are 'top maneuvering speed/velocity' over straight-line maneuvering... I wouldn't be surprised that BT ships can top out at something along the lines of a dozen Gs if maneuvering isn't involved...
 

Aaron Fox

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Another thing is that nukes -last I've checked- only insta-killed ships if they make contact with the vessel in question. Showed up in a few BT vs debates from what I remember...
 

S'task

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Another thing is that nukes -last I've checked- only insta-killed ships if they make contact with the vessel in question. Showed up in a few BT vs debates from what I remember...
The nuke rules in BattleSpace are weird, and it's not that nukes are actually an instant-kill, rather, they just have a CHANCE to instant kill if they hit the target. I've been trying to find the exact rules, but the current BattleTech rulebooks are MASSIVE.

I want to say they also have to breech the armor in order to have that chance, but I'm not 100% sure on that.

Regardless, I'm of the opinion that rule should just be thrown out in VS. To be frank, the rule was created in order to make WarShips in BattleTech LESS effective and give an excuse why the Word of Blake could counter the fleets of the Inner Sphere and Clans during the Jihad with their new "Pocket Warships". The problem with this though is that if nukes were that effective against Warships, it would have come up during the Clan Invasion as a counter to the Clan's Warships, since all the Great Houses have nuclear stockpiles and delivery systems, but it was NEVER mentioned previously in any of the Classic BattleTech line from the oldest books to the Twilight of the Clans. Basically, it was a retcon to the rules in order to buff Word of Blake and just further stack the deck in their favor during the Jihad and to explain how they managed to do so much damage and set up the circumstances necessary for Devlin "Canon Sue" Stone to rise...
 

S'task

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I wouldn't be surprised that BT ships can top out at something along the lines of a dozen Gs if maneuvering isn't involved...
Oh, missed this before. The limiting factor for BattleTech ship accelleration isn't entirely their drives, it's the human factor. Remember, they have no artificial gravity, meaning no internal acceleration dampening. Thus the limit on acceleration is what the human crew can take. 12 G is a lot for the human body to take, even with acceleration couches and the like, so while they might be able to do so for a short burst, it's not something they could maintain for any length of time.
 

Aaron Fox

Well-known member
The nuke rules in BattleSpace are weird, and it's not that nukes are actually an instant-kill, rather, they just have a CHANCE to instant kill if they hit the target. I've been trying to find the exact rules, but the current BattleTech rulebooks are MASSIVE.

I want to say they also have to breech the armor in order to have that chance, but I'm not 100% sure on that.

Regardless, I'm of the opinion that rule should just be thrown out in VS. To be frank, the rule was created in order to make WarShips in BattleTech LESS effective and give an excuse why the Word of Blake could counter the fleets of the Inner Sphere and Clans during the Jihad with their new "Pocket Warships". The problem with this though is that if nukes were that effective against Warships, it would have come up during the Clan Invasion as a counter to the Clan's Warships, since all the Great Houses have nuclear stockpiles and delivery systems, but it was NEVER mentioned previously in any of the Classic BattleTech line from the oldest books to the Twilight of the Clans. Basically, it was a retcon to the rules in order to buff Word of Blake and just further stack the deck in their favor during the Jihad and to explain how they managed to do so much damage and set up the circumstances necessary for Devlin "Canon Sue" Stone to rise...
First, you've got to understand that the Clans never lost the ability to use their NLs as point defense weapons (the SLDF had the ability to switch their lasers into a quick-firing bracket mode which is partially why the PD on SLDF warships is so lacking in comparison to House designs, they can simply task their lighter naval weapons to the task) and 2) the nuke-happy Turians proved that nukes were useful against warships if you can get them to hit. Given that, initially, the Clans were seen as aliens that use stuff similar to SLDF gear, they didn't want to use valuable nukes when it won't solve the problem.
Oh, missed this before. The limiting factor for BattleTech ship accelleration isn't entirely their drives, it's the human factor. Remember, they have no artificial gravity, meaning no internal acceleration dampening. Thus the limit on acceleration is what the human crew can take. 12 G is a lot for the human body to take, even with acceleration couches and the like, so while they might be able to do so for a short burst, it's not something they could maintain for any length of time.
Thing is, that is for anything above 10Gs for more than (if I remember right) 5 minutes. Then there is the possibility of all sorts of drugs that they've cooked up to help with that.

Mass Effect doctrine goes into the refuse bin the moment that the heavy hitters (cruisers and dreadnaughts) go faster than 5Gs if I remember right.

It should be also noted that Battletech armor is designed to minimize the capability of light-mass/high-velocity munitions...
 

Bear Ribs

Well-known member
The nuke rules in BattleSpace are weird, and it's not that nukes are actually an instant-kill, rather, they just have a CHANCE to instant kill if they hit the target. I've been trying to find the exact rules, but the current BattleTech rulebooks are MASSIVE.

I want to say they also have to breech the armor in order to have that chance, but I'm not 100% sure on that.

Regardless, I'm of the opinion that rule should just be thrown out in VS. To be frank, the rule was created in order to make WarShips in BattleTech LESS effective and give an excuse why the Word of Blake could counter the fleets of the Inner Sphere and Clans during the Jihad with their new "Pocket Warships". The problem with this though is that if nukes were that effective against Warships, it would have come up during the Clan Invasion as a counter to the Clan's Warships, since all the Great Houses have nuclear stockpiles and delivery systems, but it was NEVER mentioned previously in any of the Classic BattleTech line from the oldest books to the Twilight of the Clans. Basically, it was a retcon to the rules in order to buff Word of Blake and just further stack the deck in their favor during the Jihad and to explain how they managed to do so much damage and set up the circumstances necessary for Devlin "Canon Sue" Stone to rise...
Interstellar Operations Page 172.

Nukes do no damage to WarShips unless they are physically touching the hull at the moment of detonation, there's no effect if it detonates next to the hull instead. Capital damage is rated at 2 points per kiloton of firepower.

They have a small chance for a through-armor critical like most capital weapons, which goes up with firepower. It's success on an 11+ for a 0.5Kt weapon, 10+ for a 5Kt, 9+ for 50Kt, and 8+ for a 500Kt weapon (that is, you have to roll that number or higher with two 6-sided die). The pattern's pretty obvious for extrapolation purposes. If a nuke does crit a WarShip, it ignores the normal critical table and hits only internal structure, but inflicts 10 times more structural damage than it's total capital damage.

Whether or not the critical hit happens, a ship hit by a nuke must make a control roll with a steep (+4) penalty, and will suffer a +2 penalty to attack rolls and -2 to cluster rolls for one turn as due to the EMP temporarily scrambling the sensors.
 

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