Kirov class Battlecrusier ISOT to WW2

Duke Nukem

Hail to the king baby
So a Kirov class Battlecrusier along with its crew is transported to the World war two era, what would happen?
 

PsihoKekec

Swashbuckling Accountant
Not much, Eastern front was mostly ground combat and Soviet union does not have spare parts and ammo to keep Kirov going. Out of curiosity, which configuration of Kirov?
 

Duke Nukem

Hail to the king baby
Not much, Eastern front was mostly ground combat and Soviet union does not have spare parts and ammo to keep Kirov going. Out of curiosity, which configuration of Kirov?
The most modern configuration which is Project 11442m i think..
 

PsihoKekec

Swashbuckling Accountant
Nakhimov is still undergoing refit, so it would be Peter the Great, which is stationed in Murmansk, where I guess it could do a couple trips to protect the convoys or bait the german warships, before it was stuck to port due to lack of spare parts.

Honestly, Sverdlov class cruisers would be more usefull as they would still be an advanced ships (although not as nearly ROFL stompy as Kirov), but one that Soviets could actually maintain.
 

Duke Nukem

Hail to the king baby
Nakhimov is still undergoing refit, so it would be Peter the Great, which is stationed in Murmansk, where I guess it could do a couple trips to protect the convoys or bait the german warships, before it was stuck to port due to lack of spare parts.

Honestly, Sverdlov class cruisers would be more usefull as they would still be an advanced ships (although not as nearly ROFL stompy as Kirov), but one that Soviets could actually maintain.
Didn't kirovs carry nukes at some point?
 

Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
Sotnik
The radar and sonar should make it quite valuable for convoy escorting in the perilous Arctic Convoy routes. Combined with those anti ship missiles and initial surprise it could even help sink the German heavy warships that were annoying the Allies by being a fleet in being hiding out in those Norwegian fjords.

The ship could definitely play an important direct role in that regard and substantially benefit the Allied and in particular Soviet war effort in that regard.

A really important butterfly us how the 2020 Russians would react to Stalinism or rather vice versa. Stalin seems like the type who'd value the technology transfer but wouldn't care much for the crew if they don't tow the line. The Russians are probably too patriotic to defect to the Western Allies but they're still in danger being 2020 era Russians in a Stalinist Soviet Union.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Granits could carry nuclear warheads, I don't know how many they had issued during peacetime.


They almost certainly still carry them as that would be the only sure way for a Kirov battlegroup to remove a carrier from existence and justify its own existence. IIRC it was normally 2-4 of the 20 tubes
 

ATP

Well-known member
So a Kirov class Battlecrusier along with its crew is transported to the World war two era, what would happen?

In 1944 when soviet destroyed GA Center, they also cut off GA North.German send one HC and 4 DD,destroyed soviet forces which guarded germans,and GA North could fought till 1945.
That is not all.german cruisers and pocket battleships bombarded soviet forces till they were out of ammo,and 2 capitol ships lost on Baltic was sunked by british HEAVY BOMBERS.
When soviets had 10:1 advantage in air.During entire war BOTH soviet fleet and air forces sunked 2 german small DD.

So,if soviets manage to use it,Kirow could destroy all german cruisers/4/ and pocket battleships/2/ there.
And soviets could end war faster.If they destroy GA North,maybe in 1944.

What next ? Stalin was cautious,so he planned WW3 after 1953.Now, he could start earlier.And with technology from Kirow, he could win.
 

ATP

Well-known member
It hits a mine :p The Germans made massive use of mine warfare in the Baltic and it turned out to be highly effective at bottling up the Soviet naval forces.
Indeed.I do not knew, if Kirow have any stuff good in finding mines,but i doubt it.
Or...crew undarstandt,that they come back to papa Stalin soviets, and run to Sweden.Making Sweden most advanced country in the world.And probably owner of few A bombs,too.
 

ATP

Well-known member
So,we had 3 scenarios :
1.Kirow escaped to Sweden wary of Stalin.Sweden as regional superpower,Stalin start another purge in 1945,not 1952.Otherwise, nothing change.
2.Kirow remained loyal and sunk on mine.Nothing changed.
3.Kirow avoided mines, german GA North destroyed in 1944,WW2 end in 1944 too,soviets take more Germany and Denmark.
With Kirow technology WW3 in 1950,Europe taken over.Africa and most Asia follow.
But - they still do not cinqer americas, so soviet union would fall for economical reasons about 2020.And historians would wonder not if soviets genocided between 20 - 60 millions, but 200-400 millions.
Only good side - at least thare would be no leftist in Western Europe anymore.
 

Tryglaw

Well-known member
So,we had 3 scenarios :
1.Kirow escaped to Sweden wary of Stalin.Sweden as regional superpower,Stalin start another purge in 1945,not 1952.Otherwise, nothing change.
2.Kirow remained loyal and sunk on mine.Nothing changed.
3.Kirow avoided mines, german GA North destroyed in 1944,WW2 end in 1944 too,soviets take more Germany and Denmark.
With Kirow technology WW3 in 1950,Europe taken over.Africa and most Asia follow.
But - they still do not cinqer americas, so soviet union would fall for economical reasons about 2020.And historians would wonder not if soviets genocided between 20 - 60 millions, but 200-400 millions.
Only good side - at least thare would be no leftist in Western Europe anymore.

ad.3. Soviet Union was bled dry by WW2, 1950 is way to early - both for the population to recover and to reverse-engineer Kirov technology. One generation at the very least, two would be better. Then again there could be no WW3, Kirov technology plus foreknowledge of it's crew could see the SU "win" by overtaking the West.
 

PsihoKekec

Swashbuckling Accountant
Soviet Union in 1945 simply does not have a know-how to reverse engineer the Kirov tech, it would take years for them to develop technologies and tools which would enable them to copy some of technologies in Kirov. It took Soviet Union three years to copy B-29, but that was a weapons system of the same generation of their technological advancement, while Kirov is two generations past their technological understanding, so for example the material science behind key components will be a problem for them (for the same reason the Chinese still have problems with manofacturing of jet fighter engines, despite all the stolen data), therby the most likely outcome is that they shave off a decade or more in development of some technologies, but no instawin mcguffin in the Cold War.
 

ATP

Well-known member
If they mass produce Mig17,T.55 and ił28 in 1948,and get few H bombs, then they could start WW3 in 1949.And probably take Europe.
I knew, that Kirow crew had no plans for them,but they had technology to built stuff like Mig 17 earlier.
 

Tryglaw

Well-known member
Soviet Union in 1945 simply does not have a know-how to reverse engineer the Kirov tech, it would take years for them to develop technologies and tools which would enable them to copy some of technologies in Kirov. It took Soviet Union three years to copy B-29, but that was a weapons system of the same generation of their technological advancement, while Kirov is two generations past their technological understanding, so for example the material science behind key components will be a problem for them (for the same reason the Chinese still have problems with manofacturing of jet fighter engines, despite all the stolen data), therby the most likely outcome is that they shave off a decade or more in development of some technologies, but no instawin mcguffin in the Cold War.

All true, but the Kirov comes with the crew. And these guys know the hows and the whys, what works and what does not. All dead ends and mistakes can now be avoided - and not just technology, but politics and international relations too... They will need time to "make the tools needed to make the tools", but foreknowledge is bigger asset then just the technology...
 

Duke Nukem

Hail to the king baby
All true, but the Kirov comes with the crew. And these guys know the hows and the whys, what works and what does not. All dead ends and mistakes can now be avoided - and not just technology, but politics and international relations too... They will need time to "make the tools needed to make the tools", but foreknowledge is bigger asset then just the technology...
would the Kirov crew even help the soviets in the First place.
 

Tryglaw

Well-known member
would the Kirov crew even help the soviets in the First place.

Well, that's a good question, it's Motherland on one hand, but it's Stalin's Motherland on the other... And the dysfunctionality of post-Stalin Soviet system was by design and on purpose - to prevent anyone, ever, from amassing as much power in one hand as Stalin did.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Well, that's a good question, it's Motherland on one hand, but it's Stalin's Motherland on the other... And the dysfunctionality of post-Stalin Soviet system was by design and on purpose - to prevent anyone, ever, from amassing as much power in one hand as Stalin did.

Of course.Nomenclature remembered purges, so do anything to prevent anybody to made another.
And, as a result,they created system which less and less was capable of conqering Earth,and start looking like big banana repuplic with commie oligarhy and H bombs.
Eventually,they must fall.Only Stalin version had fighting chance to conqer Earth - but becouse it means constant purges, commies rejected it.

P.S there is good soviet joke about it -
Could son of soviet general become soviet marshall ? nope, marshall have son,too.
In Stalin soviets everybody had chance to become marschall - but much more chance to be purget,too.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top