High School, College and University Cringe MegaThread

[History Learner]

Not a large scale but there are some absolutely horrible teachers who should have been fired a long time ago.

New york still has a room where the absolute worse just spend their day waisting time collecting a paycheck because they cant be fired.

I'd agree in select cases but that still takes us back to the question of systems; I think this a fundamental weak point for American Rightists as a collective body. You tend to think in terms of personalities-an explanation for why talk radio and the like does so well for Conservatives but bad for Liberals-but have a lot of trouble of pathologizing entire systems. Maybe this goes back to root psychology in that its easier to hate something when you can put a face to it like a "bad teacher" or the like, but you need to take a step back and realize that such is enabled by the broader system, which should and must always be the focus of your attacks. There is a reason, after all, in military strategy you are discouraged from dispersal of the main effort, because it weakens you overall

 

[Cherico]

I'd agree in select cases but that still takes us back to the question of systems; I think this a fundamental weak point for American Rightists as a collective body. You tend to think in terms of personalities-an explanation for why talk radio and the like does so well for Conservatives but bad for Liberals-but have a lot of trouble of pathologizing entire systems. Maybe this goes back to root psychology in that its easier to hate something when you can put a face to it like a "bad teacher" or the like, but you need to take a step back and realize that such is enabled by the broader system, which should and must always be the focus of your attacks. There is a reason, after all, in military strategy you are discouraged from dispersal of the main effort, because it weakens you overall

Actually we do have a solution for the system of education.

Make a vocher system and give parents the power to decide how to educate their children.

 

[History Learner]

Actually we do have a solution for the system of education.

Make a vocher system and give parents the power to decide how to educate their children.

Which does nothing when the State sets the curriculum and actually results in less overall control over education for parents. Lets also take a second to consider the fact this is a strategic surrender; the Benedict Option doesn't work.

 

[LordsFire]

Which does nothing when the State sets the curriculum and actually results in less overall control over education for parents. Lets also take a second to consider the fact this is a strategic surrender; the Benedict Option doesn't work.

1. Teachers Unions are a massive part of the problem. They're both corrupt, and have been funding the Democrat party for decades. They also have a long track record of propping up bad teachers, and keeping good teachers from getting properly rewarded.
2. Vouchers will inevitably give more control to parents, not less, if there is any meaningful degree of freedom to them, because it will give parents a way of defunding bad, incompetent, and corrupt schools. Right now, parents don't have that.
3. State control of curriculum should also be attacked. Schools are mostly funded locally, and as it is the local community who both have their kids in the schools and are majority paying for it, they should have control over what is taught.

 

[Bear Ribs]

Which does nothing when the State sets the curriculum and actually results in less overall control over education for parents. Lets also take a second to consider the fact this is a strategic surrender; the Benedict Option doesn't work.

How on earth does "Like now, except parents can choose their schools" give parents less control?

 

[History Learner]

How on earth does "Like now, except parents can choose their schools" give parents less control?

Because it does nothing to address the underlying problems in public schools and private schools have no reason at all to cater to parents; disagree with the curriculum? They kick you out, no hesitation.

 

[History Learner]

1. Teachers Unions are a massive part of the problem. They're both corrupt, and have been funding the Democrat party for decades. They also have a long track record of propping up bad teachers, and keeping good teachers from getting properly rewarded.

Leaving aside all the other comments to focus in on the topic at hand show me how Teacher's unions have any power over the creation of curriculum.

2. Vouchers will inevitably give more control to parents, not less, if there is any meaningful degree of freedom to them, because it will give parents a way of defunding bad, incompetent, and corrupt schools. Right now, parents don't have that.

Vouchers won't do anything if the State/Federal level has mandated things be taught because there will be no school you can go to. Want to go to a private school? Cool, what happens when they start teaching the same thing, either by Government order or because the leadership gets a hefty bribe to do so? Unlike a public school, which has to cater to some degree to parental complaint, private schools have no reason at all to do so.

3. State control of curriculum should also be attacked. Schools are mostly funded locally, and as it is the local community who both have their kids in the schools and are majority paying for it, they should have control over what is taught.

And this is why dispersal of effort is such a horrible idea because you waste resources and energy trying to fight different problems of varying importance. A "bad teacher" is fundamentally less of an issue than State or Federal elements that have the capacity effect the education of millions.

 

[Abhorsen]

private schools have no reason at all to cater to parents; disagree with the curriculum? They kick you out, no hesitation.

Yes, because that's how successful businesses act: don't buy my stuff, and I refuse to change in response to customer feedback. Just like that classic quote, what was it again? Ah yes: "The customer is always wrong"

 

[Bear Ribs]

Leaving aside all the other comments to focus in on the topic at hand show me how Teacher's unions have any power over the creation of curriculum.

How Unions Influence Education Policy

education.msu.edu

CBAs regulate education policy regarding teacher assignment and transfers, teacher evaluation, class size, grievance procedures, leaves, association rights, student placement, instruction and curriculum, layoffs, preparation periods and non-instructional duties and more. Nearly every aspect of teachers’ work and school operations is negotiated into teachers’ union contracts, leading one scholar to note that union contracts are the most important policy document governing school district operations (Hill 2006).

Vouchers won't do anything if the State/Federal level has mandated things be taught because there will be no school you can go to. Want to go to a private school? Cool, what happens when they start teaching the same thing, either by Government order or because the leadership gets a hefty bribe to do so? Unlike a public school, which has to cater to some degree to parental complaint, private schools have no reason at all to do so.

We literally have public schools responding to parental complaint by having police drag the parents out, asking the President of the United States to declare parents terrorists, and FBI agents battering in the doors of people who asked to see the curriculum.

What the heck do you consider not catering to parental complaints?

 

[History Learner]

Yes, because that's how successful businesses act: don't buy my stuff, and I refuse to change in response to customer feedback. Just like that classic quote, what was it again? Ah yes: "The customer is always wrong"

Yes, for the most part; "Go Woke Go Broke" hasn't really played out at all like you want to claim it as doing. You also seem to forget that a lot of your enemies have access to resources that you individually will never be able to match. Ever wondered why the Sierra Club went Pro Immigration? $200 million from David Gelbaum. Or, you know, groups like Pamela Shifman's "The Democracy Alliance" moves in.

 

[History Learner]

How Unions Influence Education Policy

education.msu.edu

CBAs regulate education policy regarding teacher assignment and transfers, teacher evaluation, class size, grievance procedures, leaves, association rights, student placement, instruction and curriculum, layoffs, preparation periods and non-instructional duties and more. Nearly every aspect of teachers’ work and school operations is negotiated into teachers’ union contracts, leading one scholar to note that union contracts are the most important policy document governing school district operations (Hill 2006).

Regulate, not set. Can you show me examples of CBAs enforcing the topic we're talking about?

We literally have public schools responding to parental complaint by having police drag the parents out, asking the President of the United States to declare parents terrorists, and FBI agents battering in the doors of people who asked to see the curriculum.

What the heck do you consider not catering to parental complaints?

For one, the fact they have to do it in the open and can't just deny service like a private school can, hiding behind the free market. Likewise, you can actually vote out the people in charge and replace them systematically in order to change policy; you don't have that option at most private schools.

At a certain point, you have to stop running and hiding.

 

[Abhorsen]

Yes, for the most part; "Go Woke Go Broke" hasn't really played out at all like you want to claim it as doing. You also seem to forget that a lot of your enemies have access to resources that you individually will never be able to match. Ever wondered why the Sierra Club went Pro Immigration? $200 million from David Gelbaum. Or, you know, groups like Pamela Shifman's "The Democracy Alliance" moves in.

This has nothing to do with private schools, who live and die by parents going to them. Even if one is independently funded, the parents can still afford to send their kids to another school instead.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Not sure how we got to talk about the Sierra Club but... for some cringe by comparison... a story from Commiefornia.

Homeschooling credited by parents whose kids started university at 13

Monalisa and Kip Harding, both 53, from San Jose, California, homeschooled all 10 of their children. They knew they were on the right track after their first three kids graduated high school by 11.

www.dailymail.co.uk

They homeschooled all ten of their kids. All of them have gone to college, some as early as the age of 13. They've gone on to become Doctors and Lawyers and Engineers. One became a Lawyer at the age of 19!

 

[Bear Ribs]

Regulate, not set. Can you show me examples of CBAs enforcing the topic we're talking about?

You're splitting a hair so fine it doesn't exist. There is no functional difference between a group regulating something and setting it.

As far as examples, the NEA are among the ones pushing critical race theory hard.

National Education Association Votes To Push “Critical Race Theory” Into K-12 Schools Across The Country

Puts the lie to claims CRT is not taught in K-12: NEA Representative Assembly passes Resolutions requiring NEA action "Supporting and leading campaigns that ... Result in increasing the implementation of ... critical race theory ... curriculum in pre- K-12 and higher education"

legalinsurrection.com

Embracing critical theory, teacher’s union says they — not parents — control what kids learn

The political left wants critical race theory in every school district in the nation.The nation’s largest teachers union has approved a plan to promote critical race theory in all 50 states and 14,…

nypost.com

https://kansaspolicy.org/nea-pledges-127k-to-promote-critical-race-theory/

For one, the fact they have to do it in the open and can't just deny service like a private school can, hiding behind the free market. Likewise, you can actually vote out the people in charge and replace them systematically in order to change policy; you don't have that option at most private schools.

At a certain point, you have to stop running and hiding.

No you can't. The Unions push critical race theory, and you can't fire teachers they have pushing it because the Unions have negotiated rules that prevent the teachers from being replaced. No amount of voting will help with that. OTOH, if a private school suddenly sees their precious, precious money going away because teachers disapprove of their ways, they'll change quite quickly.

 

[Husky_Khan]

This side discussion was initiated by a false dilemma anyways. You can shit on Teachers Unions and School Boards at the same time. Nothing has been forwarded in this thread that it's impossible to pursue both avenues but we're arguing like it is because one poster loves Public Sector Unions. In fact, you can shit on and work against Teachers Unions, School Boards in their current states and shitty Democratic funded private schools at the same time. Shockingly, you can even do ALL OF THE ABOVE at or on a School Board while having kids home schooled, or in a more appropriate private school, or having them being debriefed of their BS public school education OR not having kids at all! 😮

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Chicago Cancels Classes for 2nd Day as Teachers Refuse to Teach In-Person (theepochtimes.com)

I thought about putting this in the Wuhan virus thread, but, at this point, THIS is purely political and shitty.

 

[Abhishekm]

Chicago Cancels Classes for 2nd Day as Teachers Refuse to Teach In-Person (theepochtimes.com)

I thought about putting this in the Wuhan virus thread, but, at this point, THIS is purely political and shitty.

Something something Work at Home is better for Teaching but you still need as many teachers as you would for In Person and pay the same!

 

[Sobek]

500 School Districts Publicly Declare Only Woke Teachers Need Apply

The skyrocketing wokeness of administrators who control teacher hiring will ensure that all classrooms are devoted to indoctrination.

thefederalist.com

 

[Cherico]

500 School Districts Publicly Declare Only Woke Teachers Need Apply

The skyrocketing wokeness of administrators who control teacher hiring will ensure that all classrooms are devoted to indoctrination.

thefederalist.com

homes schooling and private schooling expecially religious schools will explode helping create a paralee system this education will also out perform public education by a wide margin.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

I tried to dig out the list of ~500 school districts that use the Nimble hiring software. None of the articles I've seen show a list. I actually emailed Nimble to see if they would provide said list. Guess you're just going to have to ask you're local districts if they are using Nimble as a hiring tool. If they are, follow up and ask if they are using political qualifiers in their hiring process. You know, questions like, "What have you done to be more anti-racist?" If they are then tell them to stop.