Imperalism

Arch Dornan

Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
I'm assuming we are talking about sub-Saharan Africa, as Northern Africa did develop Middle-Ages level tech, and they did try to expand but were pushed back? :)

I have to admit I'm not all that familiar with African history, but maybe some area that doesn't have too hostile climate, such as Southern Africa?
How about these?


They're more correct empires for their descendants to relate to.
 

Lanmandragon

Well-known member
I guess it would require so large changes from OTL, that it's a total unknown. Becoming a technically developed society would have changed their societies and mindsets so radically, that it's impossible to say.
Not really the Bantu people's invaded colnized and genocided all kinds of folks. They just lacked the tech to do so worldwide. Conquest is a human constant just like music or art. Personally I always foud it hilariously hypocrisy. When nation's {like the jncans and Aztecs and a bunch other}. Try to guilt the Euros for doing exactly what they themselves were just better. It's basically just whining your not the bully anymore.
 

Scottty

Well-known member
Founder
Not really the Bantu people's invaded colnized and genocided all kinds of folks. They just lacked the tech to do so worldwide. Conquest is a human constant just like music or art. Personally I always foud it hilariously hypocrisy. When nation's {like the jncans and Aztecs and a bunch other}. Try to guilt the Euros for doing exactly what they themselves were just better. It's basically just whining your not the bully anymore.

The tech the Bantu tribes had, that the other Sub-Saharan peoples did not, was Iron Working. Nice sharp metal spearheads.
What other Sub-Saharan peoples, you ask?
Exactly.

Though they hadn't finished off the Pygmies or the Khoi by the time the European powers arrived.
 

Lanmandragon

Well-known member
The tech the Bantu tribes had, that the other Sub-Saharan peoples did not, was Iron Working. Nice sharp metal spearheads.
What other Sub-Saharan peoples, you ask?
Exactly.

Though they hadn't finished off the Pygmies or the Khoi by the time the European powers arrived.
Yep that was my point though. The Euro conquests were only different in scale.
 

Arch Dornan

Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
Not really the Bantu people's invaded colnized and genocided all kinds of folks. They just lacked the tech to do so worldwide. Conquest is a human constant just like music or art. Personally I always foud it hilariously hypocrisy. When nation's {like the jncans and Aztecs and a bunch other}. Try to guilt the Euros for doing exactly what they themselves were just better. It's basically just whining your not the bully anymore.
It took some decades to decide landgrabbing wasn't too popular anymore. Wonder when that'll change?

Though they hadn't finished off the Pygmies or the Khoi by the time the European powers arrived.
Fortunate or mixed benefit for them dealing with a distant overlord to a closer one?
 

Lanmandragon

Well-known member
It took some decades to decide landgrabbing wasn't too popular anymore. Wonder when that'll change?


Fortunate or mixed benefit for them dealing with a distant overlord to a closer one?
It never did it's just less obvious now usally. What do you think the Crimea thing, or China's current colonization of Africa aren't landgrabs?
 

Prince Ire

Section XIII
Frankly Scotty that's a cop out and you know it. "Imperalism" in the modern context very very much. Refers directly and explicitly refers. To the European conquest of the world. Don't play bullshitsemantic games. Your better then that bro.
Except not really. Even if we're limiting ourselves to the 16th-19th centuries, there's still plenty of non-European imperialism. Japan is the most famous example, but China expanded during this period and established a settler colony in Taiwan. The Ottoman Empire expended further into the Balkans. Egypt colonized Sudan (and the Egyptians explicitly referred to Sudan as an Egyptian colony), etc.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Except not really. Even if we're limiting ourselves to the 16th-19th centuries, there's still plenty of non-European imperialism. Japan is the most famous example, but China expanded during this period and established a settler colony in Taiwan. The Ottoman Empire expended further into the Balkans. Egypt colonized Sudan (and the Egyptians explicitly referred to Sudan as an Egyptian colony), etc.

Wait, by Japanese Imperialism you mean what they did during WWII?
 

OliverCromwell

Permanently Banned
Permanently Banned
Net positive I suppose.
The British Empire spread the Protestant faith, the Protestant work-ethic, Anglo-Saxon respect for individual rights and limiting the power of rulers, across a wide swath of the world. Uncounted millions of people will be going to Heaven who would otherwise have gone to Hell.
On a more personal note - some of my own ancestors were apparently dirt-poor people who got a whole new start by moving out to the Colonies. The wise apple curses not the tree.

The Spanish Empire, on the other hand, spread the culture of 17th-century Spain across much of the world. A form of Christianity in which the gospel was obfuscated by superstition and ritual. A cruel philosophy of government.
The legacy of the conquistador is the mindset that wealth and prosperity are things to be gained by robbery and violence. Wealth is something other people just somehow have, and if you want it you need to take it from them.
When I look at the American Democrat party's new little mascot, AOC with her too-wide donkey-face grin, and consider her proposed policies in the light of history, I say: "Well, you would think like that, wouldn't you, little miss Cortez! Found some new Cities of Gold to plunder, have you?"

(In the long run the Spanish wrecked their own economy, and that of many other Old World nations, with the glut of silver they imported across the Atlantic. But that's another story.)

Even the Pinochet-fanboyism we sometimes indulge in on this forum, ironically of course, creeps me out on a certain level. It's the values and mindset of the Latinosphere seeping in and polluting the Anglosphere.
I created this account and its ridiculous beliefs as a joke but I now see that I could never outdo reality.
 

Lanmandragon

Well-known member
Except not really. Even if we're limiting ourselves to the 16th-19th centuries, there's still plenty of non-European imperialism. Japan is the most famous example, but China expanded during this period and established a settler colony in Taiwan. The Ottoman Empire expended further into the Balkans. Egypt colonized Sudan (and the Egyptians explicitly referred to Sudan as an Egyptian colony), etc.
No it certainly is the colloquial use of "imperalism". Is definitely talking about European conquest keep being a pedantic ass though. It's amuses me.
 

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