Culture Explaining Monogamy to Vox

Navarro

Well-known member
A fascinating article debunking some poorly-sourced arguments made in favour of "free love".


Personally the most important part is found here:

There is a reason why anthropologist Joseph Henrich describes normative monogamy as “sexual egalitarianism.” It’s not that a monogamous marriage itself is unique—across the vast majority of societies, the majority of marriages have nearly always been monogamous—the key difference is primarily in the way normative monogamy acts to prevent polygyny, through social norms and legal enforcement. The main alternative to monogamy throughout history has not been an egalitarian, polyamorous free for all, but rather a relatively small number of elite males having multiple, sometimes even dozens, of wives. There are rare examples of polyandry being practiced, as I described here, but they are generally restricted to very specific socioecological conditions (such as a highly skewed sex ratio, high male mortality, extended male absence, or among brothers to maintain land inheritance) that don’t often co-occur.

In the Ethnographic Atlas, 85 percent (1041 out of 1231) of societies are coded as practicing at least occasional polygyny, with 15 percent (186 out of 1231) practicing only monogamy, and less than one percent (4 out of 1231) practicing polyandry.

Towards the end of the video, we hit aggressive levels of self-parody, when the narrator implies that the idea of sexual selection represented a Victorian-era conspiracy by patriarchal male scientists, and that monogamy is a “made up construct” and a “way to enforce gender roles”.

Yet, as Henrich and his colleagues persuasively argue, “In suppressing intrasexual competition and reducing the size of the pool of unmarried men, normative monogamy reduces crime rates, including rape, murder, assault, robbery and fraud, as well as decreasing personal abuses.” Henrich et al. sum up their argument, writing that:
We propose that the unusual package of norms and institutions that constitute modern monogamous marriage systems spread across Europe, and then the globe, because of the package’s impact on the competitive success of the polities, nations and religions that adopted this cultural package. Reducing the pool of unmarried men and levelling the reproductive playing field would have decreased crime, which would have spurred commerce, travel and the free flow of ideas and innovations.

Normative monogamy seems to have important group-level benefits, and tends to reduce the kinds of harmful behaviors associated with greater intrasexual competition, among both males and females.
 

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
I am in favor of consenting adults being allowed to do as they will as far as sexual relationships go. I'm hardly a traditionalist myself, but whatever. I think the main disconnect here is that these people don't want to feel like they're ... not normal, for whatever reason. Like they need external validation for their debauchery. I guess I don't really understand, personally. Make your choices and accept the consequences that go along with it like a grown-ass adult. I also don't understand this need to write articles detailing their exploits in anything outside of adult magazines (and even then I wouldn't be particularly interested).
 

FriedCFour

PunishedCFour
Founder
I am in favor of consenting adults being allowed to do as they will as far as sexual relationships go. I'm hardly a traditionalist myself, but whatever. I think the main disconnect here is that these people don't want to feel like they're ... not normal, for whatever reason. Like they need external validation for their debauchery. I guess I don't really understand, personally. Make your choices and accept the consequences that go along with it like a grown-ass adult. I also don't understand this need to write articles detailing their exploits in anything outside of adult magazines (and even then I wouldn't be particularly interested).
Because do whatever you want as a consenting adult and you have no business in the bedroom is a lie for them. They are actively anti-monogamy and want to encourage people to take up polyamory and cuckoldry and and whatevers in between. They want people not to just be with one person and that's it, so they need to say actually polyamory is normal and you are weird and wrong because you don't want to furiously masturbate in the closet while your wife gets plowed by other dudes.
 

Arch Dornan

Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
Because do whatever you want as a consenting adult and you have no business in the bedroom is a lie for them. They are actively anti-monogamy and want to encourage people to take up polyamory and cuckoldry and and whatevers in between. They want people not to just be with one person and that's it, so they need to say actually polyamory is normal and you are weird and wrong because you don't want to furiously masturbate in the closet while your wife gets plowed by other dudes.
I hear there's now lots of cucking.
 

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
I wonder if these wahmens are for masturbating while their husband and/or boyfriend plows some other women, or if it's a "for me but not for thee" thing because they find it empowering or some such.

In any case I guess what I still get as the upshot is that they feel the need for external validation and don't want to be looked on as weirdos even though they really are in the minority when it comes to their views on sex and relationships. Well, considering the way they are about everything else, I suppose it could be just another example of them crowing about how they view themselves and their lifestyles as superior to all the mundanes they look down their noses at.

I honestly kind of wonder about people who claim to be poly and if they're actually cool with it, or just going along with it.
 

LifeisTiresome

Well-known member
I wonder if these wahmens are for masturbating while their husband and/or boyfriend plows some other women, or if it's a "for me but not for thee" thing because they find it empowering or some such.
Its obviously the bold. These women want the stability and finances of a committed relationship while at the same time the ability to just fuck all the "chad" or "alpha" or whatever you want to call it, men that she can find.


This article brings up one very interesting point.

The male tendency to seek these substitutes may be the biggest single reason why sex and marriage rates are dropping. A new Cornell University study shows that women are still likely to be more attracted to and want to marry men with stronger economic prospects.

In other words, despite decades of positive strides for women in the workplace and beyond, women still find a wealthier man more attractive. So men still have to work harder to attract women.

Women are getting more degrees and taking more jobs but they still want wealthy men even though the jobs for said men are drying up partly cause of women.

And even if you managed to get the woman, she will cheat on you and have kid with some poor guy who has abs and then divorce your ass taking everything you have worked so hard for.

Hence men are checking out:

But now they have porn, video games, and other technology to provide them with much easier to obtain substitutes for that gratification. Avoiding the pressure to earn more to get more is likely also behind the multibillion-dollar race to create a realistic sex robot industry.
 
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CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Porn, videogames, hentai manga, ecchi manga, comicbook fanservice, fanservice in text, fanservicey 2D pics etc

I can see why lots of men can give up on relationships with actual women, much less stressful and risky

Speaking of sexbots, how long till artificial wombs are made? Get sperm and a donated or somehow cloned egg and you can have a child of your own without
 

Arch Dornan

Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
Porn, videogames, hentai manga, ecchi manga, comicbook fanservice, fanservice in text, fanservicey 2D pics etc

I can see why lots of men can give up on relationships with actual women, much less stressful and risky

Speaking of sexbots, how long till artificial wombs are made? Get sperm and a donated or somehow cloned egg and you can have a child of your own without
Slowly there. It's always the small steps.

Attempts of an artificial womb have been attempted on a baby lamb.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Slowly there. It's always the small steps.

Attempts of an artificial womb have been attempted on a baby lamb.

I think there was an anime where men went to Mars, had lots of gynoids and the women who ruled earth got REALLY pissed when the men on Mars were actually succeeding in making gynoids with wombs

The artificial womb alongside the sexbot maybe fully banned

The latter will be said to objectify or demean women or make it so that even though men occupy themselves with the sexbot, they are still a sexual predator threat to real women or give women psychological issues due to not being able to deal with the “unrealistic beauty standards”
 

Arch Dornan

Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
I think there was an anime where men went to Mars, had lots of gynoids and the women who ruled earth got REALLY pissed when the men on Mars were actually succeeding in making gynoids with wombs

The artificial womb alongside the sexbot maybe fully banned

The latter will be said to objectify or demean women or make it so that even though men occupy themselves with the sexbot, they are still a sexual predator threat to real women or give women psychological issues due to not being able to deal with the “unrealistic beauty standards”
Will it be global or just specific locations?
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Will it be global or just specific locations?

The ban will probably be in mostly Western countries with FarLeft governments that really “Respect Women” and are against the demeaning image of these sexbots and whatever precedents that the artificial wombs could do on whatever hold women have over men.

May also be outright banned in Islamic countries ruled by Sharia Law, but will have a black market with the sexbots being sold. They will probably be very okay with the artificial wombs though.

The ban will be widespread, but it will lead to lots of women with regrets when they get older when it comes to romantic relationships....they may use the artificial wombs then
 

Darth Robbhi

Protector of AA Cruisers, Nemesis of Toasters
Super Moderator
Staff Member
I am in favor of consenting adults being allowed to do as they will as far as sexual relationships go. I'm hardly a traditionalist myself, but whatever. I think the main disconnect here is that these people don't want to feel like they're ... not normal, for whatever reason. Like they need external validation for their debauchery. I guess I don't really understand, personally. Make your choices and accept the consequences that go along with it like a grown-ass adult. I also don't understand this need to write articles detailing their exploits in anything outside of adult magazines (and even then I wouldn't be particularly interested).
That also requires self awareness, and an understanding of what you want and don't, what you can handle and can't, what trust you have in your partner(s), and how you are able to handle the inevitable jealousies that come with attention paid to someone else, or lack thereof.

Most people default to monogamous emotional relationships even if they are sexually open. And most non-monogamous emotional situations get very messy, as do many sexual situations where the non-prime participants try moving up the food chain.

The other aspect is whether these are truly open, or keeping your options open. Essentially, are open or poly relationships another aspect of the friends with benefits, where you are dating without dating, and thus free to pursue anything that interests you.
 

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
I think there was an anime where men went to Mars, had lots of gynoids and the women who ruled earth got REALLY pissed when the men on Mars were actually succeeding in making gynoids with wombs
Armitage III

The artificial womb alongside the sexbot maybe fully banned

The latter will be said to objectify or demean women or make it so that even though men occupy themselves with the sexbot, they are still a sexual predator threat to real women or give women psychological issues due to not being able to deal with the “unrealistic beauty standards”
Hell, that's already happening with sex dolls.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
Armitage III


Hell, that's already happening with sex dolls.

I remember in another thread how it was discussed that women have a sort of evolutionary behavioral pattern in-regards to other women, especially ones that are prettier than them

Unlike men who may more likely look on someone who is stronger as being real helpful, the women will be more likely to see them as competition and a sort if danger

“Soyboys” and “Male Feminists” may feel the same with other manly men as well

So both maybe why there is so much feelings of how fictional depictions of manly men and attractive females are “problematic”

Jealousy even for 2D pictures or nonreal people
 

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
Honestly I think the butthurt over good looking women in media is that it makes the women who are lazy and out of shape feel bad about the fact that they are lazy and out of shape. I think that they actually know this and just can't admit it to themselves, which is why they try to claim they are representative of what "real women" are like. It all goes in to their view of themselves as being so much better than everyone else.

I am reminded of a particular feminist I knew from my undergrad days who posted on Facebook about how she and her fiance tried working out for all of one hour on one day, and gave up on it because "it hurt." She rationalized her unwillingness to do anything about her own lack of fitness because in her mind, the fact she was sore after trying the one time meant that nature didn't intend it, or something to that effect. Can you imagine?
 

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
I'd dispute that. Aside from my own personal experience, I'd actually use otherwise monogamous relationships as an example in the form of people who remarry after losing or divorcing their previous spouse. Of course someone can love and respect more than one person at once, but that's hardly all there is to a relationship. The thing I think they're lacking is depth. It mostly just seems to be about sex with them. I just hope they never have kids. I know that's what they want anyway, but honestly it's for the better that these people don't reproduce. ;)
 

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